H Emily Recon Reports

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drezee
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#181 Postby drezee » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:11 pm

senorpepr wrote:Well, remember that dropsondes don't report sustained winds. That is exactly why the NHC didn't upgrade at 8pm. All the data shown that sustained winds, even 30-sec winds remained under cat 5 status. The dropsonde can't produce a one-minute wind, thanks to gravity. The time it spends measuring a parcle of atmosphere is faster than you can blink. Those winds in the dropsonde were gusts until proven otherwise by flight level winds.


Flight level winds aren't 1-minute winds either. There are no 1-min winds taken in recon, so what is the point? Dropsondes are however used to determine the real strength of a system. Read the NHC's own words at the bottom. I believe the real truth of the matter is that the NHC will not upgrade a borderline system, because of what it means to history. They do NOT want to second guess on this one. Either way they lose....

Option 1: They upgrade Emily to Cat 5: They have data that people can use against them to say it wasn't. Ala Accuweather, the "real" meteorlogical community

Option 2: They don't upgrade it, the only people who even think about upgrading it with the current data are the people on boards like this. NO FEAR There....

The 11pm advisory includes this:
EMILY HAS REMAINED ESSENTIALLY STEADY-STATE DURING THE PAST FEW
HOURS AS A HIGH-END CATEGORY FOUR HURRICANE. HOWEVER... AN
AIRCRAFT RECON FIX AT 2340Z DID INDICATE THE CENTRAL PRESSURE HAD
FALLEN 8 MB SINCE 18Z TO 929 MB... AND A MORE RECENT FIX MEASURED
931 MB. THE MAXIMUM 700 MB FLIGHT LEVEL WIND IN THE NORTHEASTERN
QUADRANT WAS 149 KT... WHICH SUPPORTS MAINTAINING THE INTENSITY AT
135 KT.
DVORAK T-NUMBERS WERE 6.5 FROM SAB AND AFWA AND 7.0 FROM
TAFB... SO THERE IS NOT MUCH BASIS ON WHICH TO UPGRADE TO A
CATEGORY FIVE AT THIS TIME.


The 5pm said this:

EMILY HAS CONTINUED TO STRENGTHEN THIS AFTERNOON. AT ABOUT 17Z...AN
AIR FORCE RESERVE HURRICANE HUNTER AIRCRAFT INDICATES THAT THE
CENTRAL PRESSURE HAS FALLEN TO 937 MB...WITH 700 MB FLIGHT-LEVEL
WINDS AS HIGH AS 151 KT IN THE NORTHEASTERN QUADRANT. THIS SUPPORTS
THE INITIAL INTENSITY OF 135 KT.
THERE IS A POSSIBILITY THAT EMILY
HAS GOTTEN STRONGER SINCE THE AIRCRAFT LEFT THE STORM. HOWEVER...
THE SATELLITE SIGNATURE DOES NOT YET SUPPORT STRONGER WINDS...SO
ANY FURTHER INCREASE IN THE INTITAL WINDS WILL WAIT FOR THE NEXT
AIRCRAFT SCHEDULED NEAR 00Z.


11am:

EMILY HAS UNDERGONE ANOTHER ROUND OF STRENGTHENING THIS MORNING. AN
AIR FORCE RESERVE HURRICANE HUNTER AIRCRAFT INDICATES THAT THE
CENTRAL PRESSURE HAS FALLEN TO 943 MB...WITH 700 MB FLIGHT-LEVEL
WINDS AS HIGH AS 148 KT. THIS WOULD NORMALLY SUPPORT SURFACE WINDS
OF 130-135 KT. HOWEVER...THE CENTRAL PRESSURE AND EYEWALL
DROPSONDES DO NOT YET SUPPORT WINDS THIS HIGH. THUS...THE INITIAL
INTENSITY IS SET TO 125 KT
...WHICH IS IN AGREEMENT WITH SATELLITE
INTENSITY ESTIMATES FROM TAFB AND SAB.
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#182 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:22 pm

drezee wrote:Flight level winds aren't 1-minute winds either. There are no 1-min winds taken in recon, so what is the point? Dropsondes are however used to determine the real strength of a system. Read the NHC's own words at the bottom. I believe the real truth of the matter is that the NHC will not upgrade a borderline system, because of what it means to history. They do NOT want to second guess on this one. Either way they lose....


Actually, the MINOBS do have one-min averaged winds and 30-sec period peak winds as defined as the maximum 10-sex average wind within that 30-sec period. Of course, in the course on that one minute, they sample winds over a 5-6 mile stretch. However, this is more reliable than the dropsonde that is fall vertically.
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#183 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:22 pm

Flight Level Data
Storm Name: EMILY (05L)
Mission Number: 10
Flight ID: AF304
Flt Data Number: 41
Latest Ob Location: 184 mi WSW of Kingston, Jamaica

Ob #01: 03:08:00Z; 16.8°N 80.9°W; PA: 10000 ft; D-Value: 112 ft; Wind: NW (323°) @ 25 mph; Max Wind: 25 mph; Temp: 47°F; Dewpt: 36°F
Ob #02: 03:08:30Z; 16.8°N 80.8°W; PA: 9993 ft; D-Value: 110 ft; Wind: NW (325°) @ 28 mph; Max Wind: 29 mph; Temp: 47°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #03: 03:09:00Z; 16.9°N 80.8°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: 106 ft; Wind: NW (314°) @ 29 mph; Max Wind: 31 mph; Temp: 48°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #04: 03:09:30Z; 16.9°N 80.8°W; PA: 9990 ft; D-Value: 103 ft; Wind: NW (305°) @ 29 mph; Max Wind: 30 mph; Temp: 49°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #05: 03:10:00Z; 16.9°N 80.8°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: 100 ft; Wind: NW (308°) @ 29 mph; Max Wind: 29 mph; Temp: 49°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #06: 03:10:30Z; 16.9°N 80.8°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: 98 ft; Wind: NW (309°) @ 29 mph; Max Wind: 30 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #07: 03:11:00Z; 17°N 80.7°W; PA: 9990 ft; D-Value: 94 ft; Wind: NW (312°) @ 31 mph; Max Wind: 32 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #08: 03:11:30Z; 17°N 80.7°W; PA: 9993 ft; D-Value: 90 ft; Wind: NW (314°) @ 30 mph; Max Wind: 30 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #09: 03:12:00Z; 17°N 80.7°W; PA: 9990 ft; D-Value: 85 ft; Wind: NW (311°) @ 32 mph; Max Wind: 33 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #10: 03:12:30Z; 17°N 80.7°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: 81 ft; Wind: NW (307°) @ 35 mph; Max Wind: 35 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #11: 03:13:00Z; 17.1°N 80.7°W; PA: 9993 ft; D-Value: 76 ft; Wind: WNW (302°) @ 36 mph; Max Wind: 37 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 38°F
Ob #12: 03:13:30Z; 17.1°N 80.7°W; PA: 9987 ft; D-Value: 69 ft; Wind: NW (307°) @ 40 mph; Max Wind: 40 mph; Temp: 51°F; Dewpt: 38°F
Ob #13: 03:14:00Z; 17.1°N 80.6°W; PA: 10007 ft; D-Value: 63 ft; Wind: NW (306°) @ 43 mph; Max Wind: 44 mph; Temp: 51°F; Dewpt: 39°F
Ob #14: 03:14:30Z; 17.1°N 80.6°W; PA: 9984 ft; D-Value: 52 ft; Wind: NW (315°) @ 48 mph; Max Wind: 48 mph; Temp: 51°F; Dewpt: 40°F
Ob #15: 03:15:00Z; 17.2°N 80.6°W; PA: 10000 ft; D-Value: 44 ft; Wind: NW (320°) @ 51 mph; Max Wind: 52 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 40°F
Ob #16: 03:15:30Z; 17.2°N 80.6°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: 30 ft; Wind: NW (318°) @ 55 mph; Max Wind: 56 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 41°F
Ob #17: 03:16:00Z; 17.2°N 80.6°W; PA: 9993 ft; D-Value: 13 ft; Wind: NW (320°) @ 55 mph; Max Wind: 61 mph; Temp: 51°F; Dewpt: 42°F
Ob #18: 03:16:30Z; 17.2°N 80.6°W; PA: 9839 ft; D-Value: -9 ft; Wind: NW (324°) @ 62 mph; Max Wind: 65 mph; Temp: 49°F; Dewpt: 42°F
Ob #19: 03:17:00Z; 17.2°N 80.6°W; PA: 9872 ft; D-Value: -31 ft; Wind: NW (323°) @ 66 mph; Max Wind: 69 mph; Temp: 53°F; Dewpt: 43°F
Ob #20: 03:17:30Z; 17.3°N 80.5°W; PA: 10020 ft; D-Value: -54 ft; Wind: NW (317°) @ 73 mph; Max Wind: 76 mph; Temp: 53°F; Dewpt: 44°F


...going into the SW eyewall now...
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#184 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:30 pm

Flight Level Data
Storm Name: EMILY (05L)
Mission Number: 10
Flight ID: AF304
Flt Data Number: 42
Latest Ob Location: 193 mi W of Kingston, Jamaica

Ob #01: 03:18:00Z; 17.3°N 80.5°W; PA: 10049 ft; D-Value: -87 ft; Wind: NW (312°) @ 81 mph; Max Wind: 85 mph; Temp: 53°F; Dewpt: 45°F
Ob #02: 03:18:30Z; 17.3°N 80.5°W; PA: 9974 ft; D-Value: -141 ft; Wind: NW (307°) @ 90 mph; Max Wind: 96 mph; Temp: 54°F; Dewpt: 47°F
Ob #03: 03:19:00Z; 17.3°N 80.5°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: -222 ft; Wind: WNW (297°) @ 103 mph; Max Wind: 105 mph; Temp: 49°F; Dewpt: 48°F
Ob #04: 03:19:30Z; 17.3°N 80.4°W; PA: 9659 ft; D-Value: -316 ft; Wind: W (277°) @ 100 mph; Max Wind: 111 mph; Temp: 51°F; Dewpt: 49°F
Ob #05: 03:20:00Z; 17.4°N 80.4°W; PA: 9800 ft; D-Value: -371 ft; Wind: W (271°) @ 60 mph; Max Wind: 75 mph; Temp: 65°F; Dewpt: 44°F
Ob #06: 03:20:30Z; 17.4°N 80.4°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: -413 ft; Wind: W (269°) @ 17 mph; Max Wind: 29 mph; Temp: 67°F; Dewpt: 37°F
Ob #07: 03:21:00Z; 17.4°N 80.4°W; PA: 9984 ft; D-Value: -424 ft; Wind: E (84°) @ 26 mph; Max Wind: 40 mph; Temp: 68°F; Dewpt: 38°F
Ob #08: 03:21:30Z; 17.5°N 80.4°W; PA: 9984 ft; D-Value: -403 ft; Wind: ENE (78°) @ 70 mph; Max Wind: 85 mph; Temp: 65°F; Dewpt: 45°F
Ob #09: 03:22:00Z; 17.5°N 80.4°W; PA: 9987 ft; D-Value: -351 ft; Wind: ENE (78°) @ 111 mph; Max Wind: 119 mph; Temp: 58°F; Dewpt: 51°F
Ob #10: 03:22:30Z; 17.5°N 80.4°W; PA: 10069 ft; D-Value: -322 ft; Wind: E (85°) @ 123 mph; Max Wind: 128 mph; Temp: 54°F; Dewpt: 52°F
Ob #11: 03:23:00Z; 17.5°N 80.4°W; PA: 10292 ft; D-Value: -280 ft; Wind: E (95°) @ 150 mph; Max Wind: 157 mph; Temp: 50°F; Dewpt: 56°F
Ob #12: 03:23:30Z; 17.5°N 80.4°W; PA: 10745 ft; D-Value: -228 ft; Wind: E (98°) @ 173 mph; Max Wind: 174 mph; Temp: 45°F; Dewpt: 59°F
Ob #13: 03:24:00Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 10991 ft; D-Value: -187 ft; Wind: E (96°) @ 174 mph; Max Wind: 176 mph; Temp: 42°F; Dewpt: 60°F
Ob #14: 03:24:30Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 11296 ft; D-Value: -158 ft; Wind: E (98°) @ 173 mph; Max Wind: 176 mph; Temp: 42°F; Dewpt: 60°F
Ob #15: 03:25:00Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 11555 ft; D-Value: -128 ft; Wind: ESE (105°) @ 172 mph; Max Wind: 174 mph; Temp: 40°F; Dewpt: 59°F
Ob #16: 03:25:30Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 11102 ft; D-Value: -117 ft; Wind: ESE (105°) @ 167 mph; Max Wind: 169 mph; Temp: 41°F; Dewpt: 58°F
Ob #17: 03:26:00Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 10541 ft; D-Value: -111 ft; Wind: ESE (106°) @ 165 mph; Max Wind: 166 mph; Temp: 42°F; Dewpt: 58°F
Ob #18: 03:26:30Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 9944 ft; D-Value: -105 ft; Wind: ESE (110°) @ 160 mph; Max Wind: 162 mph; Temp: 43°F; Dewpt: 57°F
Ob #19: 03:27:00Z; 17.6°N 80.4°W; PA: 10039 ft; D-Value: -82 ft; Wind: ESE (115°) @ 153 mph; Max Wind: 156 mph; Temp: 43°F; Dewpt: 56°F
Ob #20: 03:27:30Z; 17.6°N 80.3°W; PA: 9997 ft; D-Value: -58 ft; Wind: ESE (118°) @ 146 mph; Max Wind: 149 mph; Temp: 42°F; Dewpt: 55°F

...out of the NW eyewall now... standby for VDM.
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#185 Postby Normandy » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:31 pm

Doesnt that warrant 160 mph winds?
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#186 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:31 pm

153kt or 137.7kt on the sfc. That would be 158.63mph. I would tend to think this supports cat 5 / 160 mph.
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#187 Postby Normandy » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:32 pm

Well now i think its official...Emily is a record breaker (again).
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#188 Postby Stratosphere747 » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:32 pm

Wow...
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#189 Postby Scorpion » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:32 pm

Cat 5!!!!!!!!! :woo: :woo:
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#190 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:34 pm

Scorpion wrote:Cat 5!!!!!!!!! :woo: :woo:


:yayaya: Yeah, cat five... something to hoot and holler about. :roll:
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#191 Postby stormie_skies » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:34 pm

finally.......Em has been such a tease today..... :sadly:
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#192 Postby gkrangers » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:34 pm

Its still borderline. Winds do appear to have slightly increased tho.
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#193 Postby Hyperstorm » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:34 pm

And, those are not the strongest winds, yet.

I expect much higher winds in the NE qudrant. In any case, this further supports the upgrade.

I expect a category 5 at 2am IF NOT sooner...
Last edited by Hyperstorm on Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#194 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:35 pm

Hyperstorm wrote:Those are not the strongest winds, yet....

I expect much higher winds in the NE qudrant. In any case, this further supports the upgrade. I exepct a category 5 at 2am IF NOT sooner...


Ummm... that was the NE quad.
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#195 Postby Scorpion » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:35 pm

Its been borderline so long its about time we have a 5. Hopefully it weakens before landfall.
Last edited by Scorpion on Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#196 Postby Normandy » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:36 pm

Hyperstorm wrote:And, those are not the strongest winds, yet.

I expect much higher winds in the NE qudrant. In any case, this further supports the upgrade.

I expect a category 5 at 2am IF NOT sooner...


Those are NE quad winds, they wont get any stronger than that.

I find it very interesting that they found those winds considering Emily's southern eyewall is veeery weak (convectionwise at least) right now.
Last edited by Normandy on Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#197 Postby senorpepr » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:36 pm

Scorpion wrote:Not the highest winds?? Sweet..


?!? Sweet?! :roll:
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#198 Postby jkt21787 » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:37 pm

They should issue a special advisory for this. Not only has this crossed a category but its crossed into the highest of them all...
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#199 Postby stormie_skies » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:37 pm

senorpepr wrote:
Scorpion wrote:Cat 5!!!!!!!!! :woo: :woo:


:yayaya: Yeah, cat five... something to hoot and holler about. :roll:


Well, it would be a shame for her to have be so close and yet not recieve the title...

Here's hoping that she is maxing out and will undergo a weakening EWRC before she touches the Yucatan....
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#200 Postby CajunMama » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:37 pm

Oh jeezum...pray for those in her path. That's death and destruction. :cry:
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