Tonight on TalkinTropics...Outrageous Accuweather Email

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Tonight on TalkinTropics...Outrageous Accuweather Email

#1 Postby MWatkins » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:34 pm

First of all, am I the only person getting unsolicited email from Slack-u-weather?

Second of all, here is part of the outrageously funny email I received today.
“An early-season storm striking the Gulf Coast the way Tropical Storm Arlene just did was a warning shot," said Bastardi, who correctly forecast in early May that the Gulf or western Caribbean would experience an early-June storm this year.

What's wrong with this statement?

Hey I had nothing much to discuss tonight on the show...now...I have plenty. There is much more Slack-u-Weather press-release BS to address tonight. They have taken it upon themselves to go at the NHC head on it appears. We will be going through this entire email...and Slack-u-Weather in general, as well as the usual tropics stuff starting at 10:00PM tonight.

http://radio.nhcwx.com

MW
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#2 Postby yoda » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:36 pm

I don't see what is wrong with it... could you explain Mike? Thanks.
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Re: Tonight on TalkinTropics...Outrageous Accuweather Email

#3 Postby patsmsg » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:48 pm

MWatkins wrote:...<snip>
Second of all, here is part of the outrageously funny email I received today.
“An early-season storm striking the Gulf Coast the way Tropical Storm Arlene just did was a warning shot," said Bastardi, who correctly forecast in early May that the Gulf or western Caribbean would experience an early-June storm this year.

What's wrong with this statement?
<snip>

MW


I guess I don't get it either. What's the outrageous part?
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#4 Postby Swimdude » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:50 pm

It's possible that the first sentence could be interpreted as reference to another storm that followed Arlene, which of course would be false.

I just think the wording of that first sentence could've been better.
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#5 Postby Steve » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:54 pm

Other than it's unsolicited, what's the beef? JB doesn't play the Steve Lyons or NHC game. Believe me, I wish he were with some other outfit than Accuweather because he's the only thing they've got going for them. But he digs a lot deeper into the future. People bash him all the time, but none of them ever want to put their own asses on the line. I don't recall any guru on this site, at the weather service or anywhere else talking about the 2nd week of June as a potential trouble spot in the Western Caribbean or Eastern Gulf back in early May.

Not saying you Mike, but there are too many weather weenies who really are wannabes who get all pissed off at Joe B. because they can't hang with his pattern recognition skills. That's all there is to it. He said after Arlene, watch after a trof split in the 10-15 day period in the WC or Gulf again. That would be mid-late next week. Even if there is only a deep surge of tropical moisture, who else was offering a heads up at a possible 2nd June storm (besides guesscasters) and also giving the methodology?

Screw paying for any of ACCU's services, but there isn't much comparison for what Joe does and what anyone else on here that bashes him does. That's a fact.

Steve
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#6 Postby Steve » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:56 pm

>>It's possible that the first sentence could be interpreted as reference to another storm that followed Arlene, which of course would be false.

No. It's about the future of the 2005 season and Joe's interpretation. A link to the video where it was first mentioned is already posted.

Steve
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#7 Postby Thunder44 » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:14 pm

I bet the critizism not that JB was flat out wrong. But just that prediction was not impressive at all, or that he never gave an actual forecast.

If you watch TWC you would know June typically gets a named storm every other year. And Gulf and Carribean are the usual hot spots. Last year we didn't have a named storm in June so...
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#8 Postby MWatkins » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:20 pm

Steve wrote:Other than it's unsolicited, what's the beef? JB doesn't play the Steve Lyons or NHC game. Believe me, I wish he were with some other outfit than Accuweather because he's the only thing they've got going for them. But he digs a lot deeper into the future. People bash him all the time, but none of them ever want to put their own arses on the line. I don't recall any guru on this site, at the weather service or anywhere else talking about the 2nd week of June as a potential trouble spot in the Western Caribbean or Eastern Gulf back in early May.

Not saying you Mike, but there are too many weather weenies who really are wannabes who get all pissed off at Joe B. because they can't hang with his pattern recognition skills. That's all there is to it. He said after Arlene, watch after a trof split in the 10-15 day period in the WC or Gulf again. That would be mid-late next week. Even if there is only a deep surge of tropical moisture, who else was offering a heads up at a possible 2nd June storm (besides guesscasters) and also giving the methodology?

Screw paying for any of ACCU's services, but there isn't much comparison for what Joe does and what anyone else on here that bashes him does. That's a fact.

Steve


Well, here's one thing...and I don't have a lot of time now so I'll have to address this more later. It's an easy principle and it happens over and over again (and please note I am not bashing Joe B here, he didn't write nor send the article...this beef is with Accuweather...and it is a much larger beef than just this statement or email):

When you cover every single possibiliy, you can't be wrong.

Where else, besides the Gulf or Western Caribbean is a June storm going to hit? Answer, in the last 100+ years, is no where else. Yet, the article (not JB here, the ARTICLE) suggests it's a big deal that he called for a storm someplace in the western Caribbean or Gulf, as if something else is possible. Calling for an early June storm (does that mean before the 15th?) what does that really mean...there's no context...it's not verifiable and they are playing by a different set of rules than the NHC does.

There is much much more than this in the email, which looks more like a press release, and like I said I will cover it tonight.

Here's a similar prediction from me so I can go ahead and have someone write an email about it in September.

"There will probably be a hurricane in August, and it could strike the US Coast from Brownsville to Maine, or perhaps someplace in the Lesser Antillies or the Caribbean sea, if not it will go out to sea and maybe affect Bermuda."

MW
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#9 Postby x-y-no » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:20 pm

Steve wrote:>>It's possible that the first sentence could be interpreted as reference to another storm that followed Arlene, which of course would be false.

No. It's about the future of the 2005 season and Joe's interpretation. A link to the video where it was first mentioned is already posted.

Steve


A link to his "forecast in early May that the Gulf or western Caribbean would experience an early-June storm this year?"

Where is that posted? I'd like to see just how he worded a "forecast" more than a month out.

Jan
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#10 Postby MWatkins » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:22 pm

x-y-no wrote:
Steve wrote:>>It's possible that the first sentence could be interpreted as reference to another storm that followed Arlene, which of course would be false.

No. It's about the future of the 2005 season and Joe's interpretation. A link to the video where it was first mentioned is already posted.

Steve


A link to his "forecast in early May that the Gulf or western Caribbean would experience an early-June storm this year?"

Where is that posted? I'd like to see just how he worded a "forecast" more than a month out.

Jan


Bingo.

MW
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#11 Postby Agua » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:31 pm

It was worded in very general terms. He predicted a trough split in the northern gulf to occur in the first couple weeks of June, development in the western carribean and whatever developed heading toward the trough.
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#12 Postby Anonymous » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:47 pm

I don't really see the need to be so harsh, but that is me. After all...he made a correct prediction, and he said it may be a sign of things to come..which it might.
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#13 Postby kevin » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:50 pm

Many things might. Prediction involves quantification and if you can't do that you're a fortune teller.
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#14 Postby MWatkins » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:59 pm

~Floydbuster wrote:I don't really see the need to be so harsh, but that is me. After all...he made a correct prediction, and he said it may be a sign of things to come..which it might.


Sure, it COULD very well be a sign of things to come. But you know what that means, scientifically? Zero. I am going to stick by my prediction. And you can quote me on this because it is just as accurate, and predictive, and useful:

"There will probably be a hurricane in August, and it could strike the US Coast from Brownsville to Maine, or perhaps someplace in the Lesser Antillies or the Caribbean sea, if not it will go out to sea and maybe affect Bermuda."

-Mike Watkins
June, 2005


MW
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#15 Postby Aquawind » Thu Jun 16, 2005 4:39 pm

Aww Darn and I wanted to discuss Global Warming's imapct on the 2005 Season? :P :lol:

PHONES WILL BE OPEN TONIGHT!! ..yea that was loud.. :)

Paul
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#16 Postby jax » Thu Jun 16, 2005 4:47 pm

name calling?

i think we have a few HUNDRED people here in this
group that take on the NHC pretty regular...

i didn't think this was a HATE group here...
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#17 Postby SouthernWx » Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:13 pm

yoda wrote:I don't see what is wrong with it... could you explain Mike? Thanks.


Well Matt, for one thing....it didn't take a genius (or degreed met) to see the risk of a June storm was much greater this season. I posted at another forum in late May (Talkweather Alabama)...and stated my theory there would be a named storm before June 11th. Also, the above normal sst and long range guidance at the end of May was giving clear indications something was coming out of the western Caribbean; the only question in my mind? Would it be tropical or subtropical...

I'm not bashing Bastardi or Accu-Weather, so please don't misunderstand. IMO JB is a very good forecaster, and the folks whom I know that work with Joe say he's a great guy. I've just noticed where he and Accu-Weather in general does a lot of "tooting" their own horns when an analysis is correct....but when they are wrong, the silence is sometimes deafening.

Just my 0.02¢ worth...

Perry
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#18 Postby Swimdude » Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:22 pm

Excuse my incorect suggestion. :(
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#19 Postby Steve » Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:28 pm

>>Well, here's one thing...and I don't have a lot of time now so I'll have to address this more later. It's an easy principle and it happens over and over again (and please note I am not bashing Joe B here, he didn't write nor send the article...this beef is with Accuweather...and it is a much larger beef than just this statement or email):

So is mine. They won't get a dime from me this year and possibly ever in the future despite my past patronage. I completely agree with you. But calling for a possible US landfall in August or September is a no brainer. I think Fury (no Bastardi supporter) and I have agreed on it in the past that Joe's greatest skill is pattern recognition. And he can go pretty far out with that. He did offer the following: 6 US Landfalls this sesaon, 4 of which would be hurricanes. And he's centering the action on the North Central Gulf and East Central Gulf. Will this be right or not? I don't know. We can judge him on that forecast at the end of the season.

I know you realize I wasn't bashing you because I never do (nor would I Derek who has a truly legit beef with accuwx). But I think it needed to be said that many people do dis Joe over overgenerality when in fact he is usually the first headsup on potential development. But like you said, much of that is attributable to covering everything.

Steve
Last edited by Steve on Thu Jun 16, 2005 8:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#20 Postby MWatkins » Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:34 pm

I have already received a few emails/PM's on this. Please note that my problem does not lie with JB.

Not saying you Mike, but there are too many weather weenies who really are wannabes who get all pissed off at Joe B. because they can't hang with his pattern recognition skills. That's all there is to it. He said after Arlene, watch after a trof split in the 10-15 day period in the WC or Gulf again. That would be mid-late next week. Even if there is only a deep surge of tropical moisture, who else was offering a heads up at a possible 2nd June storm (besides guesscasters) and also giving the methodology?


No argument there, Steve. My issue is with how and why Accuweather presents this info (please note: I am assuming that JB did not write the press release).

This quote outlines my concerns, and I will explain why, scientifically, later tonight (maybe it helps to remove the JB quote directly in front of the area of concern):

...who correctly forecast in early May that the Gulf or western Caribbean would experience an early-June storm this year.


Why are they presenting this in this manner? What is getting left out of the release? Why am I getting this email in the first place?

I'm going to try to answer that....

EDIT...JUST SAW STEVE's NEW POST AFTER LIGNTNING HIT RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY WINDOW:

I know you realize I wasn't bashing you because I never do (nor would I Derek who has a truly legit beef with accuscum). But I think it needed to be said that many people do dis Joe over overgenerality when in fact he is usually the first headsup on potential development. But like you said, much of that is attributable to covering everything.


I agree with this 1,000%

MW
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