ATL: ARTHUR - Models

Moderator: S2k Moderators

Message
Author
User avatar
Kingarabian
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 15979
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 3:06 am
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii

Re:

#21 Postby Kingarabian » Sat Jun 28, 2014 2:47 pm

bamajammer4eva wrote:Wow! That isn't supposed to happen this season. Does the Euro not know this is an El Nino year??

Well to be clear, we're not in an El-Nino yet.

You also are going to need consistency on behalf of the ECMWF and some sort of model consensus.

And even if you are in an El-Nino, storms can develop anytime if ideal conditions are criteria are met. Never think or let your guard down just because of an El-Nino... or a possible El-Nino.
0 likes   
RIP Kobe Bryant

User avatar
gatorcane
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 23691
Age: 47
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2005 3:54 pm
Location: Boca Raton, FL

#22 Postby gatorcane » Sat Jun 28, 2014 2:55 pm

Here is what the 12Z Euro is showing in the long-range at 192 hours as the system heads NE along the coast of the Northeastern U.S. Note the Euro showed a couple of runs of similar intensity to this last week:

Image
0 likes   

User avatar
beoumont
Category 1
Category 1
Posts: 473
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 4:13 pm
Location: East Central Florida
Contact:

Re: Re:

#23 Postby beoumont » Sat Jun 28, 2014 3:55 pm

TropicalAnalystwx13 wrote:
floridasun78 wrote:[quote="lester"
What looks wrong about it? It shows what can happen to a disturbance with several days over warm waters and in an environment of low shear and an abundance of moisture.


Probably the most extreme example was Diana, 1984, that formed from a mid level low in the same area and eventually became a Cat #4 hurricane. Of course, that was September and the ocean and environment were warmer.

Image
Last edited by beoumont on Sat Jun 28, 2014 4:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
0 likes   
List of 79 tropical cyclones intercepted by Richard Horodner:
http://www.canebeard.com/page/page/572246.htm

OuterBanker
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 1731
Joined: Wed Feb 26, 2003 10:53 am
Location: Nags Head, NC
Contact:

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#24 Postby OuterBanker » Sat Jun 28, 2014 3:57 pm

Yes, Euro has shifted back to about same track as last week, actually maybe a compromise between the two really. Where the heck is the GFS? Did it get embarrassed about their phantom monsters in the Gulf and totally abandon 91? What is going on? Hoping that the Euro is wrong for a change. Doesn't look good for the NC coast on July 4.
0 likes   

Alyono
Professional-Met
Professional-Met
Posts: 6961
Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:52 pm
Location: Texas Coast

#25 Postby Alyono » Sat Jun 28, 2014 5:52 pm

18Z keeps this east of the UH and dissipates it in about 36 hours.
0 likes   

User avatar
SFLcane
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 10163
Age: 47
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 1:44 pm
Location: Lake Worth Florida

Re:

#26 Postby SFLcane » Sat Jun 28, 2014 6:44 pm

Alyono wrote:18Z keeps this east of the UH and dissipates it in about 36 hours.


GFS is out to lunch in my view.

Image
0 likes   

stormlover2013

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#27 Postby stormlover2013 » Sat Jun 28, 2014 6:57 pm

It's been out of lunch all year lol
0 likes   

User avatar
SFLcane
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 10163
Age: 47
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 1:44 pm
Location: Lake Worth Florida

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#28 Postby SFLcane » Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:25 pm

stormlover2013 wrote:It's been out of lunch all year lol


:lol:
0 likes   

User avatar
cycloneye
Admin
Admin
Posts: 145273
Age: 68
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2002 10:54 am
Location: San Juan, Puerto Rico

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#29 Postby cycloneye » Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:49 pm

000
WHXX01 KWBC 290043
CHGHUR
TROPICAL CYCLONE GUIDANCE MESSAGE
NWS NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
0043 UTC SUN JUN 29 2014

DISCLAIMER...NUMERICAL MODELS ARE SUBJECT TO LARGE ERRORS.
PLEASE REFER TO NHC OFFICIAL FORECASTS FOR TROPICAL CYCLONE
AND SUBTROPICAL CYCLONE INFORMATION.

ATLANTIC OBJECTIVE AIDS FOR

DISTURBANCE INVEST (AL912014) 20140629 0000 UTC

...00 HRS... ...12 HRS... ...24 HRS... ...36 HRS...
140629 0000 140629 1200 140630 0000 140630 1200

LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON
BAMS 31.2N 77.7W 30.6N 77.7W 30.1N 77.9W 29.9N 78.2W
BAMD 31.2N 77.7W 30.4N 77.8W 29.8N 78.1W 29.4N 78.5W
BAMM 31.2N 77.7W 30.7N 77.9W 30.2N 78.0W 30.0N 78.3W
LBAR 31.2N 77.7W 30.6N 77.2W 30.0N 76.9W 29.7N 76.7W
SHIP 20KTS 25KTS 30KTS 35KTS
DSHP 20KTS 25KTS 30KTS 35KTS

...48 HRS... ...72 HRS... ...96 HRS... ..120 HRS...
140701 0000 140702 0000 140703 0000 140704 0000

LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON
BAMS 30.0N 78.7W 30.9N 79.3W 31.9N 79.5W 33.9N 78.0W
BAMD 29.3N 79.1W 29.4N 80.4W 30.2N 81.4W 31.7N 80.7W
BAMM 30.0N 78.6W 30.6N 79.2W 31.6N 79.6W 33.4N 78.3W
LBAR 29.8N 76.8W 30.4N 77.3W 32.2N 77.4W 35.4N 75.4W
SHIP 40KTS 45KTS 49KTS 49KTS
DSHP 40KTS 45KTS 49KTS 49KTS

...INITIAL CONDITIONS...
LATCUR = 31.2N LONCUR = 77.7W DIRCUR = 140DEG SPDCUR = 7KT
LATM12 = 32.5N LONM12 = 78.6W DIRM12 = 128DEG SPDM12 = 6KT
LATM24 = 33.4N LONM24 = 80.1W
WNDCUR = 20KT RMAXWD = 80NM WNDM12 = 20KT
CENPRS = 1017MB OUTPRS = 1018MB OUTRAD = 90NM SDEPTH = S
RD34NE = 0NM RD34SE = 0NM RD34SW = 0NM RD34NW = 0NM
0 likes   
Visit the Caribbean-Central America Weather Thread where you can find at first post web cams,radars
and observations from Caribbean basin members Click Here

User avatar
SFLcane
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 10163
Age: 47
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 1:44 pm
Location: Lake Worth Florida

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#30 Postby SFLcane » Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:50 pm

18z SREF ensembles

Image
0 likes   

supercane4867
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4966
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:43 am

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#31 Postby supercane4867 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 2:04 am

That must be the strongest Atlantic storm since.......2012

Image
0 likes   

Brent
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 38087
Age: 36
Joined: Sun May 16, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Tulsa Oklahoma
Contact:

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#32 Postby Brent » Sun Jun 29, 2014 2:20 am

What do the earlier frames look like? Close to the coast at all?
0 likes   
#neversummer

supercane4867
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 4966
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:43 am

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#33 Postby supercane4867 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 2:30 am

Looks well offshore

Image

Image
0 likes   

USTropics
Professional-Met
Professional-Met
Posts: 2648
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 3:45 am
Location: Florida State University

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#34 Postby USTropics » Sun Jun 29, 2014 2:39 am

Here are some of the spaghetti model plots that I quickly setup in google earth. The NHC generally follows closely to the TVCN (which is a consensus of the interpolated versions of the most reliable models that is adjusted for model bias).

Image
0 likes   

USTropics
Professional-Met
Professional-Met
Posts: 2648
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 3:45 am
Location: Florida State University

#35 Postby USTropics » Sun Jun 29, 2014 2:59 am

Below is the NWS Ocean Prediction Center's 24 hour forecast. You can see the high pressure area to the north acting as a blocking mechanism moving eastward with a high pressure area moving slowly westward in the GOM as well. With this progressive pattern, a trough pushes eastward from the northern plains, degrading the ridge to the north, eventually allowing 91L to escape in that direction. This is what looks to create our classical loop setup.

Image

The 12z ECMWF run from yesterday was very slow with moving this trough eastward, which allowed 91L to remain in a weak steering current longer and created a more direct impact on the U.S. as well (which was an outlier compared to the other models and even had little agreement from the ECMWF ensembles). It appears to me the 00z ECMWF run has sped up the approaching trough a bit more, pushing that high pressure area to the east quicker, which in turn allows 91L to move towards the north quicker (with no direct U.S. impact). The timing of the trough and how quickly it breaks down the ridge to the north will determine when 91L will be able to move north and then northeast around the periphery of that high pressure area. Nonetheless, it's a very complicated setup for models to forecast and results in weak steering.

Also, the ECMWF has a high pressure area moving eastward behind the trough that is expected to pickup 91L and move it out to sea. Generally, when we have this setup (and Alex from 2004 is a good example) we have a high pressure area to the east and to the west of the system, and we see a large pressure gradient that allows for a system to strengthen (especially if this system were to stay over the Gulf Stream, in a low shear environment). At the time, the strengthening of Alex was unexpected and not forecast by the models (if memory serves correct).
0 likes   

bamajammer4eva
Category 4
Category 4
Posts: 907
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 3:21 am
Location: Ozark, AL

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#36 Postby bamajammer4eva » Sun Jun 29, 2014 5:00 am

Very bold and shocking prediction from Weatherbell forecaster J Bastardi for 91L. While unofficial, he is respected by the media as a 2nd opinion and I wouldn't be surprised to see the news media begin to ramp up the hype machine now.


Guidance on what will be Arthur very close to our idea.Greatest threat outer banks around July 4.Should be hurricane


Model is below
Image

Source
https://twitter.com/BigJoeBastardi/stat ... 1241952256
0 likes   

User avatar
cycloneye
Admin
Admin
Posts: 145273
Age: 68
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2002 10:54 am
Location: San Juan, Puerto Rico

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#37 Postby cycloneye » Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:34 am

TROPICAL CYCLONE GUIDANCE MESSAGE
NWS NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
1227 UTC SUN JUN 29 2014

DISCLAIMER...NUMERICAL MODELS ARE SUBJECT TO LARGE ERRORS.
PLEASE REFER TO NHC OFFICIAL FORECASTS FOR TROPICAL CYCLONE
AND SUBTROPICAL CYCLONE INFORMATION.

ATLANTIC OBJECTIVE AIDS FOR

DISTURBANCE INVEST (AL912014) 20140629 1200 UTC

...00 HRS... ...12 HRS... ...24 HRS... ...36 HRS...
140629 1200 140630 0000 140630 1200 140701 0000

LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON
BAMS 30.0N 77.7W 29.3N 78.0W 28.9N 78.4W 29.0N 78.9W
BAMD 30.0N 77.7W 29.1N 77.8W 28.5N 78.1W 28.2N 78.4W
BAMM 30.0N 77.7W 29.2N 77.7W 28.8N 77.9W 28.7N 78.2W
LBAR 30.0N 77.7W 29.4N 77.6W 28.9N 77.9W 28.6N 78.1W
SHIP 20KTS 23KTS 28KTS 32KTS
DSHP 20KTS 23KTS 28KTS 32KTS

...48 HRS... ...72 HRS... ...96 HRS... ..120 HRS...
140701 1200 140702 1200 140703 1200 140704 1200

LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON LAT LON
BAMS 29.5N 79.4W 30.9N 80.0W 33.0N 79.5W 36.2N 76.2W
BAMD 28.1N 78.8W 28.7N 79.6W 29.4N 79.5W 29.7N 78.2W
BAMM 29.1N 78.3W 30.2N 78.5W 31.8N 77.9W 34.3N 75.3W
LBAR 28.8N 78.4W 29.9N 79.0W 31.7N 78.8W 35.0N 75.8W
SHIP 37KTS 45KTS 49KTS 51KTS
DSHP 37KTS 45KTS 49KTS 51KTS

...INITIAL CONDITIONS...
LATCUR = 30.0N LONCUR = 77.7W DIRCUR = 180DEG SPDCUR = 5KT
LATM12 = 31.2N LONM12 = 77.9W DIRM12 = 166DEG SPDM12 = 9KT
LATM24 = 32.5N LONM24 = 78.6W
WNDCUR = 20KT RMAXWD = 70NM WNDM12 = 20KT
CENPRS = 1016MB OUTPRS = 1019MB OUTRAD = 160NM SDEPTH = S
RD34NE = 0NM RD34SE = 0NM RD34SW = 0NM RD34NW = 0NM
0 likes   
Visit the Caribbean-Central America Weather Thread where you can find at first post web cams,radars
and observations from Caribbean basin members Click Here

ninel conde

#38 Postby ninel conde » Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:39 am

looks to me like the euro is the only model that does much with it, and the euro can often falsely deepen storms out of the tropics.
0 likes   

User avatar
cycloneye
Admin
Admin
Posts: 145273
Age: 68
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2002 10:54 am
Location: San Juan, Puerto Rico

Re: ATL: INVEST 91L - Models

#39 Postby cycloneye » Sun Jun 29, 2014 8:18 am

12z tracks.

Image
0 likes   
Visit the Caribbean-Central America Weather Thread where you can find at first post web cams,radars
and observations from Caribbean basin members Click Here

tolakram
Admin
Admin
Posts: 20009
Age: 62
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:23 pm
Location: Florence, KY (name is Mark)

Re:

#40 Postby tolakram » Sun Jun 29, 2014 8:33 am

ninel conde wrote:looks to me like the euro is the only model that does much with it, and the euro can often falsely deepen storms out of the tropics.


I'm not familiar with that being a trait of the euro.

Anyway, if you follow the GFS 6Z vorticity it takes this over Florida, which is why it never does much with development. Near the end of the run it deepens the vorticity as it takes the area right up the coast.

The Canadian keeps it off shore but never does much with it.
0 likes   
M a r k
- - - - -
Join us in chat: Storm2K Chatroom Invite. Android and IOS apps also available.

The posts in this forum are NOT official forecasts and should not be used as such. Posts are NOT endorsed by any professional institution or STORM2K.org. For official information and forecasts, please refer to NHC and NWS products.


Return to “2014”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests