Hurricane Camille Satellite Image

[CrazyC83]

They have Betsy at 123 KTS only slightly weaker than Camille.....doubt it....MGC

My guess for Betsy at landfall is 100 kt (pressure 948mb). It was likely around 120-125 kt in the Gulf.

[hurricanesurvivor]

We lived on the west side of New Orleans during Camille and evacuated to Picayune, MS, where the eye came directly over us (I know, bad decision!). We left in such a hurry we left our garbage cans sitting at the end of the driveway. We expected them to be gone when we returned home, but they were still there and had not even been knocked over! There wasn't even any tree limbs in our yard or any other debris. Yet Picayune was demolished, only 50 miles away.

[OpieStorm]

We had a respectable surge here on the Mississippi Coast from both Ike and Gustav. I'd rather face a small Cat-4 like Charley than a big Cat-2 like Ike. The water destroys so much more.....MGC

unless you are one of the unlucky ones that encounter the cat 4 winds. Whe gusts in a cat 4 are basically EF4 tornadoes (EF5 in a cat 5)

Those cat 4 winds are not going to affect nearly the amount of people that a surge of a large hurricane will. Wind can do a lot of damage but it's the water that kills more.

[Derek Ortt]

We had a respectable surge here on the Mississippi Coast from both Ike and Gustav. I'd rather face a small Cat-4 like Charley than a big Cat-2 like Ike. The water destroys so much more.....MGC

unless you are one of the unlucky ones that encounter the cat 4 winds. Whe gusts in a cat 4 are basically EF4 tornadoes (EF5 in a cat 5)

Those cat 4 winds are not going to affect nearly the amount of people that a surge of a large hurricane will. Wind can do a lot of damage but it's the water that kills more.

even if you include Katrina... the surge is not even close to the deadliest aspect of an Atlantic TC. It is the factor we have not discussed... the rain

still... you'd change your tune quickly if you were hit by the strong cat 4. You wouldn't like watching entire houses flying down the street... or big slabs of concrete screaming by you

[Ed Mahmoud]

I know freshwater flooding was the number one hurricane killer in the US (and Camille caused huge floods inland to Virginia), but after Katrina, and the dead in New Orleans, which were an indirect result of surge (rain didn't collapse the levies), considering the limited number of people in the US to die in hurricanes the previous couple of decades, I'd think surge flooding and its by-products, would push surge related deaths ahead of inland drowning.




BTW, was the Lake Okechobee disaster considered surge? I know it wasn't sea surge, but wind pushing fresh water in a lake up and over/through levees is analagous to a storm surge, IMHO.

[jinftl]

I agree that surge is going to be deadlier in almost all cases. But the wind can not be underestimated....both in strength and size of area that can be impacted.

Andrew reportedly destroyed 25,524 homes and damaged 101,241 others primarily due to wind...and he was a tiny storm in size.
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/1992andrew.html

It may not happen often...but when a monster storm with Cat 4/5 winds hits a major metro region....probably a 'worst case' south florida scenario....the scope of wind damage that destroys (not just damages) homes and businesses will be as large, if not larger, than the huge areas along the coast Katrina destroyed with surge (including the flooding in New Orleans). In fact, most mets and officials cite a repeat of the 1926 Miami Hurricane as the worst case scenario for hurricanes in the u.s....with estimated damages of up to twice that caused by Katrina and effecting millions more people....and most of that will be from wind.

We had a respectable surge here on the Mississippi Coast from both Ike and Gustav. I'd rather face a small Cat-4 like Charley than a big Cat-2 like Ike. The water destroys so much more.....MGC

unless you are one of the unlucky ones that encounter the cat 4 winds. Whe gusts in a cat 4 are basically EF4 tornadoes (EF5 in a cat 5)

Those cat 4 winds are not going to affect nearly the amount of people that a surge of a large hurricane will. Wind can do a lot of damage but it's the water that kills more.

[MGC]

Does it really matter how you are killed in a hurricane? There are a bunch of different ways you can die....a tornado in a feeder band like what happened in the Florida panhandle during Ivan, inland flooding, surge like in Katrina, extreme winds like in Andrew....in most cases death can be avoided though. How many were killed in south Florida during Katrina driving around during the storm and having a tree fall on the car? I left the coast for Katrina, only hurricane I've ever left for. I still don't get why people stayed in beach front homes here on the coast for Katrina. Why did so many drown during Allison in Houston driving in waters they should not have? Fact is, most deaths in hurricanes are preventable.......MGC

[zaqxsw75050]

Does it really matter how you are killed in a hurricane? There are a bunch of different ways you can die....a tornado in a feeder band like what happened in the Florida panhandle during Ivan, inland flooding, surge like in Katrina, extreme winds like in Andrew....in most cases death can be avoided though. How many were killed in south Florida during Katrina driving around during the storm and having a tree fall on the car? I left the coast for Katrina, only hurricane I've ever left for. I still don't get why people stayed in beach front homes here on the coast for Katrina. Why did so many drown during Allison in Houston driving in waters they should not have? Fact is, most deaths in hurricanes are preventable.......MGC

+1. I still remember Ike from last year that people ignored warning and stay in their beachfront home and end up risking other people's life to save them. It was a pretty stupid decision for everyone who ignored official's warning.

[vbhoutex]

Does it really matter how you are killed in a hurricane? There are a bunch of different ways you can die....a tornado in a feeder band like what happened in the Florida panhandle during Ivan, inland flooding, surge like in Katrina, extreme winds like in Andrew....in most cases death can be avoided though. How many were killed in south Florida during Katrina driving around during the storm and having a tree fall on the car? I left the coast for Katrina, only hurricane I've ever left for. I still don't get why people stayed in beach front homes here on the coast for Katrina. Why did so many drown during Allison in Houston driving in waters they should not have? Fact is, most deaths in hurricanes are preventable.......MGC

+1. I still remember Ike from last year that people ignored warning and stay in their beachfront home and end up risking other people's life to save them. It was a pretty stupid decision for everyone who ignored official's warning.

Unfortunately this type of thing happens every season. For whatever reason many misinformed people think they know better than the trained professionals what will happen during any TC that they are experiencing. It may be due to the fact they may have been inconvenienced once when a TC turned or whatever was forecast didn't happen. It is sad fact of human nature than many do not learn from others experiences as well as their own. AS versed as I am in tropical meteorology(vs the normal everyday non weather weenie), I will never second guess the professionals if they tell me to leave even if I disagree with their forecast.

[HurricaneRobert]

A big part of their decision was justified because "it was just a category 2" and Alicia was a category 3. They weren't going to listen to anybody. Since many people who stayed on Galveston island didn't die, I think they will ride out the next one even though they don't understand that Ike's landfall to the north is probably what saved them.

[CrazyC83]

A big part of their decision was justified because "it was just a category 2" and Alicia was a category 3. They weren't going to listen to anybody. Since many people who stayed on Galveston island didn't die, I think they will ride out the next one even though they don't understand that Ike's landfall to the north is probably what saved them.

Was Alicia a Cat 3 though? A few hours before landfall, they measured something like 102 kt at flight level - at 850mb. That equates to 81 kt at the surface. Alicia was strengthening up to landfall, but not rapidly - I don't think she was more than 85 or 90 kt at landfall.

[Ed Mahmoud]

There was at least one Allison drowning death where the victim was blameless. The woman working downtown in a law firm who took the elevator to the below street level parking garage.


Not in a thousand years would someone think a parking garage might be flooded if one wasn't watching media reports.

[HurricaneRobert]

Not sure, but that's what people were saying before Ike.