ATL: Tropical Depression Fay

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wxman57
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2241 Postby wxman57 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:41 am

TreasureIslandFLGal wrote:looks pretty obviously closed. maybe a litttle elongated, but closed.


I think you need to wait for surface observations to make that determination. You sure can't tell by IR satellite imagery this morning. But it is looking very likely that a TS will form in the next 24-48 hours with nothing to stop further intensification.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2242 Postby MiamiensisWx » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:48 am

MiamiensisWx wrote:The following post is NOT an official prognosis.

Firstly, it appears that a new LLC will relocate slightly farther northeast later today. Note that WV imagery and other data indicates upper level shear has been decreasing, as 92L has passed the shear zone. Note that the outflow boundaries emanating from the western semicircle have vanished, while a poleward outflow channel is developing west of the shear zone (aided by UL divergence). The 300 mb anticyclone is building west to the north of 92L. Additionally, note that the southwesterly low level cumulus (inflow) on the SW side are now shifting to south, possibly indicating the LLC is in the process of relocating slightly farther north and east under the convection. It will be interesting if ASOS/buoy data near the eastern Caribbean begins to support this hypothesis as we enter the morning (light) hours. Obviously, the relocation has not occurred as of now, but I believe it may likely occur today.

Regardless, this one will not miss the islands. Originally, I did not anticipate development until the system passed Puerto Rico; however, I now believe we may observe classification as a tropical cyclone over the Leewards during the late afternoon hours today. Based on the current movement, 92L will likely pass through the Leewards around noon today, and it will likely affect Puerto Rico early tomorrow (i.e. around midnight). Leewards/Puerto Rico will face a threat from localized flooding via heavy precipitation along elevated terrain. Tropical storm force gusts may likely occur in association with the strongest thunderstorms across the northern Leewards and off Puerto Rico.

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/east/tatl/loop-avn.html

I would be wary to venture out in small watercraft, since the strongest thunderstorms could induce locally harsh conditions.
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#2243 Postby Gustywind » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:55 am

000
AXNT20 KNHC 141048
TWDAT

TROPICAL WEATHER DISCUSSION
NWS TPC/NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
805 AM EDT THU AUG 14 2008

TROPICAL WEATHER DISCUSSION FOR NORTH AMERICA...CENTRAL
AMERICA...GULF OF MEXICO...CARIBBEAN SEA...NORTHERN SECTIONS
OF SOUTH AMERICA...AND ATLANTIC OCEAN TO THE AFRICAN COAST
FROM THE EQUATOR TO 32N. THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION IS BASED
ON SATELLITE IMAGERY...METEOROLOGICAL ANALYSIS...WEATHER
OBSERVATIONS...AND RADAR.

BASED ON 0600 UTC SURFACE ANALYSIS AND SATELLITE IMAGERY THROUGH
1015 UTC.

...SPECIAL FEATURES...
TROPICAL WAVE IS IN THE W TROPICAL ATLANTIC EXTENDING FROM
22N60W THROUGH A 1009 MB LOW NEAR 16N61W TO 8N60W MOVING WNW
10-15 KT. SCATTERED MODERATE/ISOLATED STRONG CONVECTION IS NORTH
OF THE LOW CENTER FROM 17N-21N BETWEEN 58W-62W. UPPER LEVEL
WINDS ARE FORECAST TO GRADUALLY BECOME MORE FAVORABLE FOR
DEVELOPMENT INTO A TROPICAL DEPRESSION OVER THE DAY OR SO.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2244 Postby Emmett_Brown » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:14 am

wxman57 wrote:
TreasureIslandFLGal wrote:looks pretty obviously closed. maybe a litttle elongated, but closed.


I think you need to wait for surface observations to make that determination. You sure can't tell by IR satellite imagery this morning. But it is looking very likely that a TS will form in the next 24-48 hours with nothing to stop further intensification.


Unless land interupts it... Wxman, any idea where the center might be forming at this time?
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2245 Postby TreasureIslandFLGal » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:17 am

wxman57 wrote:
TreasureIslandFLGal wrote:looks pretty obviously closed. maybe a litttle elongated, but closed.


I think you need to wait for surface observations to make that determination. You sure can't tell by IR satellite imagery this morning. But it is looking very likely that a TS will form in the next 24-48 hours with nothing to stop further intensification.



wxman, I was hoodwinked! someone posted the quikscat and it showed the wave pattern in an obvious circular pattern, but then, as I posted, they removed it! :lol:
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#2246 Postby Gustywind » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:17 am

http://www.meteo.fr/temps/domtom/antill ... Tagant.jpg
Latest from Meteo-France 6 am this morning but this system seems a bit elongated with my untrained eyes.... Note that Meteo France is issuing an yellow alert from St Marteen and St Barth since yesterday 5 pm for a risk of strong showers added to thunderstorms....
http://www.meteo.gp/donnees/bulletin/vi ... ilance.php
Go in the left corner of the top of the page you can see the yellow symbol with rain and thunderstorms, if you want to read it clik on it, but do not forgot that this text is written in french, so you have the opportunity to try to improve your FRENCH for this time, it's free :) :D and...i can't heard ( when you read it )my friends :D lol.
Nice regards Gustywind :wink: :)
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2247 Postby Blown Away » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:29 am

What more do they need to classify this as a TD? I know, I know, confirmation there is a closed LLC, but it looks so good rate now and the NHC has classified alot less in the past.
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#2248 Postby jabber » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:35 am

Well according to the Palm Beach Post , Florida has nothing to worry about from 92:


Trio of storms unlikely to hit Fla., experts say
By JASON SCHULTZ

Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Wednesday, August 13, 2008

Three disorganized stirrings in the Atlantic could turn into tropical storms as they approach the Caribbean in the heart of hurricane season, but none is likely to near Florida, National Hurricane Center meteorologists said Wednesday night.

The first tropical wave churned a few hundred miles east of the Leeward Islands, slowly moving west, according to the center's 8p.m. forecast. The center considered the storm a moderate risk to turn into a hurricane, but according to The Weather Channel's Web site, the storm is not expected to strengthen in the near future as it moves over the Leeward Islands.

:double:
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#2249 Postby Meso » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:36 am

I think there is a good chance that if they wait for the next recon before calling it a TD it will likely go straight to Tropical Storm status. Another good convection burst on the latest visible image. Has continued to get better by each half an hour. And with the conditions ahead forecast to be conductive for intensification, I have a feeling we have an interesting few days on our hands
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Re:

#2250 Postby MiamiensisWx » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:36 am

jabber wrote:Well according to the Palm Beach Post , Florida has nothing to worry about from 92:


Trio of storms unlikely to hit Fla., experts say
By JASON SCHULTZ

Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Wednesday, August 13, 2008

Three disorganized stirrings in the Atlantic could turn into tropical storms as they approach the Caribbean in the heart of hurricane season, but none is likely to near Florida, National Hurricane Center meteorologists said Wednesday night.

The first tropical wave churned a few hundred miles east of the Leeward Islands, slowly moving west, according to the center's 8p.m. forecast. The center considered the storm a moderate risk to turn into a hurricane, but according to The Weather Channel's Web site, the storm is not expected to strengthen in the near future as it moves over the Leeward Islands.

That is incredibly sloppy journalism... wow!

Firstly, the article makes several fallacies. Note that the paragraphs suggest the NHC doesn't anticipate development. In actuality, that is far from the case.

AN AREA OF LOW PRESSURE ASSOCIATED WITH A TROPICAL WAVE IS PASSING
OVER THE NORTHERN LEEWARD ISLANDS AND IS MOVING WESTWARD AT 10 TO
15 MPH. THIS SYSTEM IS SHOWING SOME SIGNS OF ORGANIZATION...WHILE
UPPER-LEVEL WINDS ARE GRADUALLY BECOMING MORE CONDUCIVE FOR
DEVELOPMENT...AND A TROPICAL DEPRESSION COULD FORM LATER TODAY OR
ON FRIDAY. AN AIR FORCE RESERVE RECONNAISSANCE AIRCRAFT IS
SCHEDULED TO INVESTIGATE THIS SYSTEM LATER TODAY...IF NECESSARY.
REGARDLESS OF DEVELOPMENT...THIS SYSTEM COULD BRING LOCALLY HEAVY
RAINS AND GUSTY WINDS TO PORTIONS OF THE NORTHERN LEEWARD
ISLANDS...PUERTO RICO...AND HISPANIOLA DURING THE NEXT DAY OR TWO.

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/text/refresh/MIATWOAT+shtml/141133.shtml

Note the >50 percent probabilities as well.

Secondly, although the title implies the NHC doesn't anticipate an impact to the state, the article does not explicitly quote any corrobating statements from them.

Thirdly, I completely agree that it would be equally improper to imply a threat, but it would also be false to suggest that there is minimal threat to Florida.

...and in the end, I think we should focus on the immediate threat to the islands of the NE Caribbean.
Last edited by MiamiensisWx on Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:53 am, edited 2 times in total.
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#2251 Postby gatorcane » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:37 am

:uarrow:

I don't get the media sometimes. But wait, tomorrow's paper (Friday) more than likely will say the complete opposite if the NHC posts a cone with south florida within it.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2252 Postby Normandy » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:39 am

Morning folks. Thought I'd share my thoughts Re: 92L.

The thing sure looks good, and I would now venture to say its a fairly sure bet that it will be classified within 24 hours. Convection has been consistently firing over the last 12 hours, and it has consolidated very well. Its hard to determine where a center is (if there is one right now at all), but I would estimate it to be somewhere near the SW edge of the entire convective mass (Probably where that new convection is now firing). Inflow looks VERY good in the southern quadrants, and cloud motions to the north of the system are cyclonic in motion. Overall, it has the presentation right now of a VERY strong tropical wave, and a soon to be Tropical Depression.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2253 Postby SouthFLTropics » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:41 am

MiamiensisWx wrote:
jabber wrote:Well according to the Palm Beach Post , Florida has nothing to worry about from 92:


Trio of storms unlikely to hit Fla., experts say
By JASON SCHULTZ

Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Wednesday, August 13, 2008

Three disorganized stirrings in the Atlantic could turn into tropical storms as they approach the Caribbean in the heart of hurricane season, but none is likely to near Florida, National Hurricane Center meteorologists said Wednesday night.

The first tropical wave churned a few hundred miles east of the Leeward Islands, slowly moving west, according to the center's 8p.m. forecast. The center considered the storm a moderate risk to turn into a hurricane, but according to The Weather Channel's Web site, the storm is not expected to strengthen in the near future as it moves over the Leeward Islands.

That is incredibly sloppy journalism... wow!



I agree...someone should save that article and if we ended up getting hit send it back to the Post and make them eat it...

SouthFLTropics
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#2254 Postby gatorcane » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:41 am

:uarrow: I agree, I predict TS Fay forming from this within 24 hours. It's off to the races IMHO:

Image
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#2255 Postby DESTRUCTION5 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:44 am

SAT-WED...UPPER TROUGH SLOWLY LIFTING NORTHEAST SAT-SUN ALLOWS
ATLANTIC UPPER RIDGE TO START BUILDING WEST ACROSS FLORIDA AND INTO
THE GULF MON. STABLE ONSHORE FLOW WILL RESULT IN POP/S BELOW THEIR
CLIMO VALUES.

OF INTEREST STARTING SUN IS A TROPICAL WAVE MOVING FROM THE LEEWARD
ISLANDS TO THE SOUTHERN BAHAMA ISLANDS. MODELS SOLUTIONS RANGE FROM
THE ECMWF/CANADIAN OPEN WAVE TO THE GFS/NAM12 CLOSED SYSTEM. REFER
TO THE LATEST TROPICAL WEATHER OUTLOOK" onClick="return popup(this, 'notes')">OUTLOOK FROM THE NATIONAL HURRICANE
CENTER FOR MORE DISCUSSION ON THIS FEATURE.

MON THROUGH WED FORECAST DEPENDS ON WHETHER THERE IS A CLOSED SYSTEM
TO THE EAST OR AN OPEN WAVE TRAVERSING THE FLORIDA STRAITS. AFTER
COORD WITH SURROUNDING OFFICES AND LARGE AMOUNT OF UNCERTAINTY WITH
MODEL SOLUTIONS DID NOT RAMP UP WINDS AS TROPICAL FEATURE MOVES OVER
BAHAMA ISLANDS SUN-WED.

&&

.OK how can HP build in and "fay" turn N at the same time?

http://www.srh.noaa.gov/productview.php ... MLB&max=10
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2256 Postby Ed Mahmoud » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:45 am

Joe Bastardi loves Sprinsteen. He has tickets to see The Bruce on Tuesday night.

He says he thinks he will be forced to miss the Bruce, as he fears a possible Floyd-esque track, with possibly a major, with slow motion causing upwelling being the only possible saving grace for the SE Coast.


Springsteen is ok, but I didn't think much of the 'Born in the USA' album, which came out just before I started prototype at Ballston Spa, NY. He played a show at SPAC in Saratoga the day I drove up to move to Saratoga Springs in Augsut 2004, and the traffic jam Albany to Saratoga was incredible.
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#2257 Postby Weatherboy1 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:49 am

HPC early maps suggest a path over Florida -- with the turn not being as sharp as depicted in some other models. Just food for thought ...

http://www.hpc.ncep.noaa.gov/basicwx/day0-7loop.html
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#2258 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:53 am

ABNT20 KNHC 141133
TWOAT
TROPICAL WEATHER OUTLOOK
NWS TPC/NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
800 AM EDT THU AUG 14 2008

FOR THE NORTH ATLANTIC...CARIBBEAN SEA AND THE GULF OF MEXICO...

AN AREA OF LOW PRESSURE ASSOCIATED WITH A TROPICAL WAVE IS PASSING
OVER THE NORTHERN LEEWARD ISLANDS AND IS MOVING WESTWARD AT 10 TO
15 MPH. THIS SYSTEM IS SHOWING SOME SIGNS OF ORGANIZATION...WHILE
UPPER-LEVEL WINDS ARE GRADUALLY BECOMING MORE CONDUCIVE FOR
DEVELOPMENT...AND A TROPICAL DEPRESSION COULD FORM LATER TODAY OR
ON FRIDAY. AN AIR FORCE RESERVE RECONNAISSANCE AIRCRAFT IS
SCHEDULED TO INVESTIGATE THIS SYSTEM LATER TODAY...IF NECESSARY.
REGARDLESS OF DEVELOPMENT...THIS SYSTEM COULD BRING LOCALLY HEAVY
RAINS AND GUSTY WINDS TO PORTIONS OF THE NORTHERN LEEWARD
ISLANDS...PUERTO RICO...AND HISPANIOLA DURING THE NEXT DAY OR TWO.

A BROAD AREA OF LOW PRESSURE IS LOCATED ABOUT 1200 MILES EAST
OF THE LESSER ANTILLES. SHOWER ACTIVITY ASSOCIATED WITH THIS
SYSTEM REMAINS LIMITED AND DISORGANIZED AND DEVELOPMENT...IF
ANY...IS EXPECTED TO BE SLOW TO OCCUR AS THE SYSTEM CONTINUES
MOVING SLOWLY WESTWARD.

ELSEWHERE.. TROPICAL CYCLONE FORMATION IS NOT EXPECTED DURING THE
NEXT 48 HOURS.
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Re:

#2259 Postby Blown Away » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:54 am

Weatherboy1 wrote:HPC early maps suggest a path over Florida -- with the turn not being as sharp as depicted in some other models. Just food for thought ...

http://www.hpc.ncep.noaa.gov/basicwx/day0-7loop.html


The low is pretty weak as it moves over SFL, no more than a weak TS based on the pressure.
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Re: ATL: Invest 92L in Western Atlantic

#2260 Postby HURAKAN » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:58 am

Image

Image
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