INVEST 92L: Bahamas : Gone fron NRL

Moderator: S2k Moderators

Message
Author
User avatar
Blown Away
S2K Supporter
S2K Supporter
Posts: 10145
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 6:17 am

Re:

#321 Postby Blown Away » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:00 pm

Emmett_Brown wrote:I'm not at all confident on the movement of this one. Forecasting late season storms is particularly difficult because of trough interactions, and the fact that ridges and troughs begin to move more quickly.

Here is my take, in case anyone cares:

1. If we at the early period, say 72 hours, there is less modle agreement. Tracks are not in good agreement, with the Nogaps jogging NE, the GFDL and the GFS heading SSE for a time, and the Bams heading just S of W. Thats all over the compass. The rule of thumb here might be little movement at all for the first 72 hours... I predict W perhaps more slowly than indicated... into the straits by the weekend.

2. If this happens, the future track is even more uncertain. Given that a front will be on the way per GFS at about 120 hours, a more NW and then N motion might ensue. This could take the storm across the Keys, then N or NE toward the FL Panhandle, or Big Bend.

Just my opinion. Basically i think W then recurve N then NE by the front in 120 hours. E gulf storm IMO.

I agree totally, no farther than 85W IMO.
0 likes   

User avatar
KatDaddy
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 2815
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 6:23 pm
Location: League City, Texas

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#322 Postby KatDaddy » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:06 pm

Climo says SW GOM and then NE/E GOM. Opal was a prime example. Most S and SW GOM tropical cyclones in Oct have done the same. The seasons are changing.

Just imagine what this forum would have been like with Juan 1985 in late Oct. A very rare occurrence. I remember gusts to 60MPH on Galveston and 40-50MPH in Pearland 35 miles NW of Galveston.

And yes....if it makes it to Texas as a tropical cyclone it will be amazing.

I forgot to mention Jerry 1989. The first hurricane to make landfall on the TX Coast since the 1949 Hurricane. An extremely small bean hurricane. 20 miles made a hige difference between 80mph and 40 mph
Last edited by KatDaddy on Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 likes   

User avatar
HouTXmetro
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 3949
Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2004 6:00 pm
Location: District of Columbia, USA

#323 Postby HouTXmetro » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:08 pm

Didn't some of the models have this over the Yucatan earlier? Is it fair to say the models have shifted North?
0 likes   

americanrebel

#324 Postby americanrebel » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:08 pm

I remember Juan 1985 make the loops and floods all of South Central Louisiana.

I hope these guys are right that it won't make it West of 85 W, but I just don't see it with the troughs and all the different things that will effect this system (either Noel or Olga).
0 likes   

americanrebel

#325 Postby americanrebel » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:10 pm

I would have to go with the GFDL on this system.
0 likes   

Ed Mahmoud

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#326 Postby Ed Mahmoud » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:12 pm

Maybe landfall no farther West than about 85ºW, but I could see this, maybe, getting almost to 95º, due South of Beaumont in the BOC, before an Opal-esque recurve North than Northeast.

Not predicting it, but would hazard the guess, that if this does hit the Gulf Coast of the US, it will be heading between North and East-Northeast. No idea if final target is Mexico or US, and for that matter, I recall Mitch was originally forecast to the Gulf before it hit Central America.
0 likes   

User avatar
Nimbus
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 5300
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2004 10:54 am

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#327 Postby Nimbus » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:15 pm

We don't have a LLC yet. The upper level winds are quite strong around that anticyclone. A LLC would have to form near the center of the anticyclone or else it would get sheared.
0 likes   

Ed Mahmoud

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#328 Postby Ed Mahmoud » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:16 pm

CLOUDINESS...SHOWERS...AND THUNDERSTORMS OVER THE WESTERN ATLANTIC
AND PORTIONS OF THE BAHAMAS ARE ASSOCIATED WITH A BROAD SURFACE
TROUGH. THIS ACTIVITY REMAINS DISORGANIZED...AND THERE IS NO
EVIDENCE OF A SURFACE CIRCULATION AT THIS TIME. HOWEVER...
UPPER-LEVEL WINDS APPEAR TO BE SOMEWHAT FAVORABLE FOR
DEVELOPMENT...AND A TROPICAL DEPRESSION COULD FORM IN THIS AREA
DURING THE NEXT DAY OR TWO. THIS SYSTEM IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN A
SLOW WESTWARD MOTION ON THURSDAY.


Relevant portion of TWOAT
0 likes   

User avatar
'CaneFreak
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:50 am
Location: New Bern, NC

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#329 Postby 'CaneFreak » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:17 pm

Nimbus wrote:We don't have a LLC yet. The upper level winds are quite strong around that anticyclone. A LLC would have to form near the center of the anticyclone or else it would get sheared.


Ok, lets step back and think about what we just said....winds are quite strong around an ANTICYCLONE? WHAT? Not sure where that came from? do you?
0 likes   

User avatar
Nimbus
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 5300
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2004 10:54 am

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#330 Postby Nimbus » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:23 pm

The clockwise circulation is moving too fast at the moment, we allready had one small naked swirl lose its convection.
0 likes   

User avatar
'CaneFreak
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:50 am
Location: New Bern, NC

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#331 Postby 'CaneFreak » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:27 pm

Nimbus wrote:The clockwise circulation is moving too fast at the moment, we allready had one small naked swirl lose its convection.


Wow...any scientific data to back that up? sorry....I am not seeing that AT ALL...need some more information...I have been studying hurricanes for years and I cant figure out what you are talking about...please....................................................................by all means..........................
0 likes   

Matt-hurricanewatcher

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#332 Postby Matt-hurricanewatcher » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:30 pm

'CaneFreak wrote:
Nimbus wrote:The clockwise circulation is moving too fast at the moment, we allready had one small naked swirl lose its convection.


Wow...any scientific data to back that up? sorry....I am not seeing that AT ALL...need some more information...I have been studying hurricanes for years and I cant figure out what you are talking about...please....................................................................by all means..........................



I think he/she/it is talking about the strong winds shear that is moving clockwise over the northern quad of the Anticyclone. This shear is making sure that the weak LLC at 26.5-27 north on the northern side does not develop. I would watch for a LLC to form near 23-24 north inside of the deeper convection.
0 likes   

User avatar
'CaneFreak
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:50 am
Location: New Bern, NC

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#333 Postby 'CaneFreak » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:32 pm

Matt-hurricanewatcher wrote:
'CaneFreak wrote:
Nimbus wrote:The clockwise circulation is moving too fast at the moment, we allready had one small naked swirl lose its convection.


Wow...any scientific data to back that up? sorry....I am not seeing that AT ALL...need some more information...I have been studying hurricanes for years and I cant figure out what you are talking about...please....................................................................by all means..........................



I think he/she/it is talking about the strong winds shear that is moving clockwise over the northern quad of the Anticyclone. This shear is making sure that the weak LLC at 26.5-27 north on the northern side does not develop. I would watch for a LLC to form near 23-24 north inside of the deeper convection.


ok and now you make no sense...let him/her explain himself/herself
0 likes   

Ed Mahmoud

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#334 Postby Ed Mahmoud » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:36 pm

Matt-hurricanewatcher wrote:
'CaneFreak wrote:
Nimbus wrote:The clockwise circulation is moving too fast at the moment, we allready had one small naked swirl lose its convection.


Wow...any scientific data to back that up? sorry....I am not seeing that AT ALL...need some more information...I have been studying hurricanes for years and I cant figure out what you are talking about...please....................................................................by all means..........................



I think he/she/it is talking about the strong winds shear that is moving clockwise over the northern quad of the Anticyclone. This shear is making sure that the weak LLC at 26.5-27 north on the northern side does not develop. I would watch for a LLC to form near 23-24 north inside of the deeper convection.



Well, I know what you are trying to say. The naked swirl shooting West near 27ºN isn't going to be the big show.
0 likes   

User avatar
Tampa Bay Hurricane
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 5597
Age: 37
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: St. Petersburg, FL

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#335 Postby Tampa Bay Hurricane » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:40 pm

'CaneFreak wrote:
ok and now you make no sense...let him/her explain himself/herself


It is obvious from satellite looping that the ridge is inducing
anticyclonic shear over 92L but 92L has a smaller area of
developing surface circuation that is cyclonic yet embedded
in the larger anticyclone that is shearing the peripheries of the
system while simultaneously enhancing the outflow of 92L hence
the likelihood of development. The anticyclonic top is favorable for development,
yet outflow and divergence occur in a sheared anticyclonic fashion giving the
appearance of an anticyclonic rotation that is to some extent constituted
by shear.

The central core of 92L along with banding to the Southeast is taking
advantage of a niche under the anticyclone and if it can get going
it could be a pretty significant system.
Last edited by Tampa Bay Hurricane on Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 likes   

User avatar
'CaneFreak
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:50 am
Location: New Bern, NC

#336 Postby 'CaneFreak » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:43 pm

No, I know exactly what they are trying to say...its just they dont know exactly how to explain themselves...the flow around the anticyclone is undercutting the CONVECTION AT THE PRESENT TIME. The center gentlemen will form further west under the CENTER of the anticyclonic flow since the upper level ridge is located further west than the area of deepest convection at the present time. This is the same thing that happened with Katrina I believe. It eventually reformed further west DIRECTLY UNDER the UL anticyclone and the convection rebursted near the center as it chugged along to the west. Same exact setup at the present time or very similar it seems.
0 likes   

User avatar
cycloneye
Admin
Admin
Posts: 145305
Age: 68
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2002 10:54 am
Location: San Juan, Puerto Rico

Re: INVEST 92L : Models Thread

#337 Postby cycloneye » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:44 pm

Here is the 00z NAM run.I will post all the timeframes of the run in this post.

00z NAM at 66 Hours Getting Close to Florida Straits

00z NAM at 72 Hours Moving Thru Florida Straits

00z NAM at 78 Hours Still moving thru Florida Straits

00z NAM at 84 Hours Run ends with low SW of Key West
0 likes   

americanrebel

#338 Postby americanrebel » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:45 pm

So the new center sould be somewheres around 23.5N 78.5 W?
Last edited by americanrebel on Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 likes   

User avatar
'CaneFreak
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:50 am
Location: New Bern, NC

Re: INVEST 92L : Near Bahamas : Discussions & Images

#339 Postby 'CaneFreak » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:46 pm

Tampa Bay Hurricane wrote:
'CaneFreak wrote:
ok and now you make no sense...let him/her explain himself/herself


It is obvious from satellite looping that the ridge is inducing
anticyclonic shear over 92L but 92L has a smaller area of
developing surface circuation that is cyclonic yet embedded
in the larger anticyclone that is shearing the peripheries of the
system while simultaneously enhancing the outflow of 92L hence
the likelihood of development. The anticyclonic top is favorable for development,
yet outflow and divergence occur in a sheared anticyclonic fashion giving the
appearance of an anticyclonic rotation that is to some extent constituted
by shear.

The central core of 92L along with banding to the Southeast is taking
advantage of a niche under the anticyclone and if it can get going
it could be a pretty significant system.


OK...FIRST OF ALL...there is no such thing as ANTICYCLONIC SHEAR....I am laughing my *** off right now. Second of all, I really am confused about the second part of your post.
0 likes   

User avatar
Tampa Bay Hurricane
Category 5
Category 5
Posts: 5597
Age: 37
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: St. Petersburg, FL

Re:

#340 Postby Tampa Bay Hurricane » Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:46 pm

'CaneFreak wrote:No, I know exactly what they are trying to say...its just they dont know exactly how to explain themselves...the flow around the anticyclone is undercutting the CONVECTION AT THE PRESENT TIME. The center gentlemen will form further west under the CENTER of the anticyclonic flow since the upper level ridge is located further west than the area of deepest convection at the present time. This is the same thing that happened with Katrina I believe. It eventually reformed further west DIRECTLY UNDER the UL anticyclone and the convection rebursted near the center as it chugged along to the west. Same exact setup at the present time or very similar it seems.


Yup that niche Right under the anticyclone may also allow
for some rapid intensification similar to that seen in Katrina.
0 likes   


Return to “2007”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 19 guests