EPAC: HILARY - Post-Tropical - Discussion

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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Watch for Southern California

#281 Postby cycloneye » Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:56 pm

The Tropical Storm Watch from the California/Mexico border to Point
Mugu, including Catalina Island has been changed to a Tropical
Storm Warning.


Hurricane Hilary Discussion Number 11
NWS National Hurricane Center Miami FL EP092023
900 PM MDT Fri Aug 18 2023

Hilary's cloud pattern has not changed much since earlier today.
The hurricane continues to exhibit a large 30-35 n mi wide eye with
a surrounding ring of deep convection with clouds tops around -75
degrees Celsius. The latest subjective Dvorak intensity estimates
from TAFB and SAB support an initial intensity of 115 kt. The next
Air Force Reserve reconnaissance mission is currently en route, and
it should provide a better assessment of Hilary's intensity and
structure overnight.

Hilary has turned north-northwestward with an initial motion
estimate of 335/12 kt. The track forecast reasoning is unchanged
from before. Hilary is forecast to turn northward and begin to
accelerate on Saturday as it is steered by deep-layer southerly flow
between a strong subtropical ridge over the south-central United
States and an upper-level low off the coast of central California.
The models have again trended slightly faster, and the NHC foreast
has been adjusted accordingly. The NHC track forecast brings the
center near the west-central coast of the Baja California Peninsula
in about 36 hours, and along the northwestern coast of the peninsula
in 48 hours. This is near the middle of the tightly clustered
guidance envelope. Users are reminded to not focus on the exact
details of the track forecast as strong winds and heavy rainfall
will extend far from the center. These hazards will begin well in
advance of the arrival of the center.

Hilary has likely peaked in intensity, and weakening is expected to
begin on Saturday as it moves over cooler SSTs. A faster rate of
weakening is likely to begin by 24 hours as Hilary moves over
SSTs less than 26C and the vertical wind shear begins to increase.
However, Hilary is forecast to be a large hurricane when it passes
near the west-central coast of the Baja Peninsula, and a
tropical storm when it nears the U.S./Mexico border. The NHC
intensity forecast is similar to the previous advisory, and lies
close to the IVCN consensus model.

KEY MESSAGES:

1. Heavy rainfall associated with Hilary will begin well in advance
of the center, from the Baja California Peninsula into the
Southwestern United States. Preparations for the impacts of flooding
from rainfall should be completed as soon as possible, as heavy rain
will increase ahead of the center on Saturday. In the Southwestern
United States, flash, urban, and arroyo flooding is expected, with
dangerous and locally catastrophic impacts likely.

2. Hurricane conditions are expected within portions of the
hurricane warning area along the west-central coast of the Baja
California Peninsula Saturday night and are possible in the
Hurricane Watch area.

3. Tropical storm conditions are expected to begin on Sunday in
portions of southern California where a Tropical Storm Warning is in
effect.

4. Large swells generated by Hilary will affect portions of the
coast of southwestern Mexico, the Baja California peninsula, and
southern California over the next few days. These swells are likely
to cause life-threatening surf and rip current conditions.


FORECAST POSITIONS AND MAX WINDS

INIT 19/0300Z 19.7N 112.7W 115 KT 130 MPH
12H 19/1200Z 21.4N 113.6W 110 KT 125 MPH
24H 20/0000Z 24.2N 114.4W 95 KT 110 MPH
36H 20/1200Z 27.6N 115.4W 80 KT 90 MPH
48H 21/0000Z 32.1N 116.8W 55 KT 65 MPH...INLAND
60H 21/1200Z 37.8N 117.8W 30 KT 35 MPH...POST-TROP/INLAND
72H 22/0000Z...DISSIPATED

$$
Forecaster Brown
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#282 Postby Bocadude85 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 11:05 pm

0zGFS has shifted east and now shows landfall in Baja and rides the coast northward to the California border..anymore eastward shifts and this never makes a landfall in So Cal.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#283 Postby NDG » Fri Aug 18, 2023 11:18 pm

Its great satellite presentation should start deteriorating now that it has passed 20N into the much shallow warm waters south & west of Cabo which some upwelling already started occurring ahead of it.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#284 Postby cycloneye » Fri Aug 18, 2023 11:25 pm

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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#285 Postby Bocadude85 » Sat Aug 19, 2023 12:13 am

Looking at the 0z models.. all have shifted east. I’m starting to wonder if this makes a California landfall, it will most likely enter California as a tropical cyclone but I’m not sure it will make an actual landfall in the state.. nonetheless the tropical storm warnings are certainly warranted.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#286 Postby dexterlabio » Sat Aug 19, 2023 12:26 am

I remember some discussion in this forum long ago about whether a tropical cyclone could reach California as a minimal tropical storm at least, and someone argued that only an El Nino on steroids could allow that scenario to happen.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#287 Postby Sciencerocks » Sat Aug 19, 2023 2:01 am

Image
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#288 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 3:36 am

Looks like shear is finally taking a bite out of her
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#289 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 3:41 am

Also, anomalous air temperature on the ocean surface is not supporting robust WISHE interaction.

https://tropic.ssec.wisc.edu/real-time/ ... _xsect.gif

She may ramp down as fast as she ramped up.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Watch for Southern California

#290 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 3:54 am

St0rmTh0r wrote:
GCANE wrote:Minimal impact of the EWRC.
Running into a high shear environment
Yet still looks good
Warm core running through the entire troposphere
https://tropic.ssec.wisc.edu/real-time/ ... _xsect.gif

Minimal pickup of WISHE from the oceans hot water

Something is not normal

what do you mean?


Slow to weaken in the face of strong-shear, dry air, and minimal WISHE
I think this can be due to the strong vorticity.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#291 Postby Cargill » Sat Aug 19, 2023 4:24 am

I think this can be due to the strong vorticity.

Can you explain what strong vorticity is?
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#292 Postby Yellow Evan » Sat Aug 19, 2023 4:26 am

Why would a large Category 4 hurricane have minimal WISHE?
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#293 Postby NDG » Sat Aug 19, 2023 5:41 am

NDG wrote:Its great satellite presentation should start deteriorating now that it has passed 20N into the much shallow warm waters south & west of Cabo which some upwelling already started occurring ahead of it.


Just as I had thought.

Image
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#294 Postby cycloneye » Sat Aug 19, 2023 5:54 am

Hurricane Hilary Discussion Number 12
NWS National Hurricane Center Miami FL EP092023
300 AM MDT Sat Aug 19 2023

Hilary continues to display a large and well-defined eye, surrounded
by very cold convective cloud tops of -75 degrees Celsius. There
has been some noticeable thinning of the convection on the western
side of the circulation, which could indicate that the hurricane is
beginning to pull down cooler, more stable air from the north. That
said, an Air Force Reserve Hurricane Hunter aircraft measured peak
700-mb flight-level winds of 128 kt, which still supports an initial
intensity of 115 kt. The plane also found that the central pressure
has dropped slightly to 943 mb.

Hilary continues to move toward the north-northwest, or 335/11 kt.
Southerly flow between a large mid-level high over the Central
Plains and a cut-off low near the central California coast is
expected to accelerate Hilary north-northwestward and then
northward during the next 48 hours, with its forward motion likely
reaching 25-30 kt by the time the system reaches southern
California on Sunday. In fact, the track guidance has sped up
again on this cycle, and the updated NHC track forecast is a little
faster than the previous forecast after 24 hours. Users are
reminded that the exact details of the track forecast, including
where Hilary might make landfall, are of little overall importance
since strong winds and heavy rainfall will extend far from the
center. These hazards will also begin well in advance of the
arrival of the center.

The degradation of the convection on Hilary's western side probably
suggests that weakening will begin very soon. Hilary's circulation
will begin moving over sea surface temperatures colder than 26
degrees Celsius later this morning, and the cooler waters and
corresponding more stable air mass are likely to cause fast
weakening over the next couple of days. Hilary is expected to pass
near the west-central coast of the Baja California peninsula still
as a hurricane tonight, but then weaken to a tropical storm by
Sunday while it's moving near the northwestern coast of the
peninsula. Hilary will still be producing tropical-storm-force
winds when it reaches southern California on Sunday. The
circulation is likely to dissipate around or soon after 48 hours,
but a 60-hour forecast point is still provided for track continuity.


KEY MESSAGES:

1. Heavy rainfall associated with Hilary will begin well in advance
of the center, from the Baja California Peninsula into the
Southwestern United States. Preparations for the impacts of flooding
from rainfall should be completed as soon as possible, as heavy rain
will increase ahead of the center today. In the Southwestern United
States, flash, urban, and arroyo flooding is expected, with
dangerous and locally catastrophic impacts likely from tonight into
Monday.

2. Hurricane conditions are expected along the west-central coast of
the Baja California Peninsula within the hurricane warning area
tonight and Sunday morning, and are possible in the Hurricane Watch
area on Sunday.

3. Tropical storm conditions are expected to begin on Sunday in
southern California within the Tropical Storm Warning area. Winds
could be particularly strong and gusty in and near areas of higher
terrain.

4. Large swells generated by Hilary will affect portions of the
coast of southwestern Mexico, the Baja California peninsula, and
southern California over the next few days. These swells are likely
to cause life-threatening surf and rip current conditions.


FORECAST POSITIONS AND MAX WINDS

INIT 19/0900Z 20.9N 113.3W 115 KT 130 MPH
12H 19/1800Z 22.8N 113.9W 105 KT 120 MPH
24H 20/0600Z 26.2N 114.8W 85 KT 100 MPH
36H 20/1800Z 30.6N 116.0W 60 KT 70 MPH...W COAST OF BAJA CALIF
48H 21/0600Z 36.4N 117.4W 40 KT 45 MPH...INLAND
60H 21/1800Z 42.6N 117.5W 25 KT 30 MPH...POST-TROP/INLAND
72H 22/0600Z...DISSIPATED

$$
Forecaster Berg
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#295 Postby dexterlabio » Sat Aug 19, 2023 6:26 am

IDK but it's still showing a respectable satellite presentation IMO. Western eyewall thinning could be due to dry air intrusion.

Image
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#296 Postby cycloneye » Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:11 am

BULLETIN
Hurricane Hilary Intermediate Advisory Number 12A
NWS National Hurricane Center Miami FL EP092023
600 AM MDT Sat Aug 19 2023

...CATASTROPHIC AND LIFE-THREATENING FLOODING LIKELY OVER BAJA
CALIFORNIA AND THE SOUTHWESTERN U.S. THROUGH MONDAY...
...HURRICANE-FORCE WINDS EXPECTED ALONG THE WEST-CENTRAL COAST OF
THE BAJA CALIFORNIA PENINSULA TONIGHT AND SUNDAY MORNING...


SUMMARY OF 600 AM MDT...1200 UTC...INFORMATION
----------------------------------------------
LOCATION...21.5N 113.4W
ABOUT 240 MI...390 KM WSW OF THE SOUTHERN TIP OF BAJA CALIFORNIA
ABOUT 490 MI...790 KM SSE OF PUNTA EUGENIA MEXICO
MAXIMUM SUSTAINED WINDS...130 MPH...215 KM/H
PRESENT MOVEMENT...NNW OR 335 DEGREES AT 13 MPH...20 KM/H
MINIMUM CENTRAL PRESSURE...943 MB...27.85 INCHES
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#297 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:23 am

Cargill wrote:I think this can be due to the strong vorticity.

Can you explain what strong vorticity is?

Can be found on the CIMSS site with 5 levels shown
https://tropic.ssec.wisc.edu/real-time/ ... oom=&time=

Find the location of the storm. Increasing strength of vort goes from yellow to red to white.
If the vort column is vertically stacked, these will all be in the same location.
Nearly all TCs have no vort signature at 200mb indicating clockwise outflow.
Vort is counterclockwise flow.
Hilary was white, stacked at all levels at one point.
First time I saw such a strong signature at 200mb indicating the storm's vort column was exceeding the top of the troposphere or punching thru the troposphere,
This was verified by looking at the AMSU microwave soundings which shows the warm-core structure of the storm.

https://tropic.ssec.wisc.edu/real-time/ ... ation.html
https://tropic.ssec.wisc.edu/real-time/amsu/
Last edited by GCANE on Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#298 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:29 am

Yellow Evan wrote:Why would a large Category 4 hurricane have minimal WISHE?


Great question.
Microwave soundings are showing anomalous high temperatures above the ocean indicating low heat transfer to the troposphere and minimal lapse rate into the core.
Only thing I can think of is a large ingestion of extremely high CAPE air from its surroundings.
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#299 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:33 am

Just when I think the eyewall gets shredded, she comes back for another round
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Re: EPAC: HILARY - Hurricane - Discussion: TS Warning for part of Southern California

#300 Postby GCANE » Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:41 am

GCANE wrote:
Yellow Evan wrote:Why would a large Category 4 hurricane have minimal WISHE?


Great question.
Microwave soundings are showing anomalous high temperatures above the ocean indicating low heat transfer to the troposphere and minimal lapse rate into the core.
Only thing I can think of is a large ingestion of extremely high CAPE air from its surroundings.


So, I looked at Earth Null school and there was an area of very high CAPE air over the Gulf of CA.
It looks like Hilary did ingest it, nearly gone now.
May pick up more later as she moves along the Baja Coast
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