{Terror} Authorities Arrest Men With NYC Maps, Video

[gtalum]

Tourists wouldn't claim to be working as a "street vendor."

But a street vendor or a prospective street vendor might.

[wxcrazytwo]

So what, so you have lost tourrists with maps.

Tourists...or terrorists?

Tourists wouldn't claim to be working as a "street vendor."

I was joking duckie.

[BEER980]

No one said anything about their religion being illegal or a reason to deport them. What is ILLEGAL was their immigration status.

Oh I agree. Their immigration status was illegal, and the proper course of action for that is deportation, which is what they got. However, it was implied above that they should have received a punishment more severe than deportation, which further implies that they have done something illegal beyond their illegal immigration. We know precisely four facts about these guys: they immigrated illegally, they're muslims, they had maps, and they had videos of monuments. The government took the proper action for number 1. So by what basis should more punishment have been done?

I think the problem is that the story doesn't seem right. One would think they might be held in custody and make sure something is not going on here.

banshee numbers do play a role in some of the terrorist thinking. I am not sure why you think the next attack will link to 8. Is it a feeling or something you have read?

[banshee]

Its not the number itself, but the symbolism or what the number represents. Its been talked about in the intelligence community what types and when the next attacks may occur. One such theory discussed beginning somewhere around '02 were simoultaneous attacks on low value targets, we just saw a trial runs in London. Several theories have been kicked around for what may occur in the states and fortunately our people here have, so far, been able to keep such events from taking place. I'm not a terrorist expert by any stretch of the imagination, but I thought about the 9/11 (911) attacks, then the 7/7 attacks and had to wonder, with certain numbers and their relation to faith/religion, if the #8 would play a role in what comes next.

Like I said, it was just a random thought, which I probably shouldnt have expressed openly, but I'm analyst by trade, so I looked at the data given so far and came up with an idea.

[gtalum]

I think the problem is that the story doesn't seem right. One would think they might be held in custody and make sure something is not going on here.

I prefer "innocent until proven guilty" and not detaining people because "they might be up to something" despite a serious lack of evidence.

[BEER980]

I have no problem with "innocent until proven guilty" but something is not right with the whole thing. Unemployed civil or chemical engineers could be problematic. I am sure a chemical engineer would be able to come up with some homemade explosives and a civil engineer would have some good input on the construction of roads, buildings, airports, tunnels, dams, bridges, and water supply and sewage systems. I guess they might have drawn the maps for fun to showcase their talent though. They did have $8000 in $20 and $50 bills which seems a little much for only one person newly employed as a street vendor. Why is it so hard to believe that none of them could adequately explain the items they had in their possession, the large amount of money or their reasons for being in the United States? We talk a good game but we are going to get hit soon and hard if we don't tighten up.

banshee from the chatter I am seeing I don't see a good outcome in the near future. It could be all talk for all I know. You might see your 8's in a whole new light. A "new beginning" could mean several things, some good some bad. I don't see terrorist linking to the bible though.

[gtalum]

I have no problem with "innocent until proven guilty"...

Except of course when you have a "feeling" that someone "might" be guilty. Got it. That's exactly why our system presumes innocence.

[streetsoldier]

I have no problem with "innocent until proven guilty"...

Except of course when you have a "feeling" that someone "might" be guilty. Got it. That's exactly why our system presumes innocence.

Are you willing to wait long enough to hear "Allahu Akbar!!! screamed out, followed by a loud blast (if you survive it)? I'm NOT.

[BEER980]

Many cases have been solved based on a feeling. Just keep rolling out the red carpet for these guys. They are here and still coming, so it is all a matter of time. So far this year we have 120,000 OTM released in the border region and I would bet some of them mean us harm. They are all released with an order to appear and 85% of them don't.

[GalvestonDuck]

I have no problem with "innocent until proven guilty"...

Except of course when you have a "feeling" that someone "might" be guilty. Got it. That's exactly why our system presumes innocence.

Would you happen to be one of the same ones (understand, I'm not generalizing and placing you into the category yet...just asking) who fussed about President Bush and/or other government officials having some sort of warning before 9/11, but not doing anything to prevent it?

(For the record -- my thinking is that we all knew.... If only I could find my old post.)

[gtalum]

Would you happen to be one of the same ones (understand, I'm not generalizing and placing you into the category yet...just asking) who fussed about President Bush and/or other government officials having some sort of warning before 9/11, but not doing anything to prevent it?

No, actually i wasn't one of those people.

I hold President Bush as very little responsible for 9/11 when compared to his predecessor.

However, the fact remains that there are plenty of security measures that could and should have been taken (but have not) that would be effective and would not impose on our liberties.

Securing the borders is the main one of these. It just hasn't been done.

Instead, they took the precautions that look good to some, but that have very little actual effect and impose more on our liberties than truly effective security measures. Take for instance, the ridiculous airport "security" procedures, with the "random" selective secondary screening. It's stupid and ineffective, but it clearly violates our fourth amendment rights.

[banshee]

Fundamental rule in law, there is no innocent until proven guilty. Dont work like that. Tink about it, cops dont question or arrest based on innocene......its always presumed guilt.

The goons in London made 2 mistakes... A- they didnt pay close attention in chemistry so the bombs didnt explode correctly and B- by not paying attention in chem they didnt die. Too bad.

What worries me now is those who havent executed attacks here are watching and learning.

[BEER980]

banshee FYI your 8 theory might have something to it.

[j]

PLease...stop defending the rights of these soon to be deported Muslims. I'm in favor of detaining them and using using whatever it takes to find out what the hell their plans were.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, smells like a duck...its a freakin' duck.

Oh...and a comment about innocent to proven guilty....I think it was banshee who made the comment about that being absolutely false. I agree. You are arrested on the presumption of guilt, assuming there is enough reasonable evidence to support a guilty verdict. It happens all the time. These poor innocent picture taking Muslims should be held and interrogated. If they don't like it, maybe they should of stayed were they were...nice and safe and cuddly in their home town.

[GalvestonDuck]

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, smells like a duck...its a freakin' duck.

AMEN!

Er...uh...hey, wait a minute!!!!

[gtalum]

I'm not defending their rights as much as our own. If it's okay to detain and interrogate "suspicious" muslims with no evidence, then it's okay to detain and interrogate you or me with no evidence. It's truly not that big of a leap.

It's amazing what people will give up based on pure fearmongering.

[GalvestonDuck]

I'm not defending their rights as much as our own. If it's okay to detain and interrogate "suspicious" muslims with no evidence, then it's okay to detain and interrogate you or me with no evidence. It's truly not that big of a leap.

It's amazing what people will give up based on pure fearmongering.

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

[j]

I'm not defending their rights as much as our own. If it's okay to detain and interrogate "suspicious" muslims with no evidence, then it's okay to detain and interrogate you or me with no evidence. It's truly not that big of a leap.

It's amazing what people will give up based on pure fearmongering.

You know what? I'm not worried about it. If I drive down the street and I'm doing the speed limit or under, I don't have to have a heart attack when I pass by the blue meanies on the side of the road holding their radar guns. If your a Muslim, avoid suspicious activity that is consistant with terrorism.

For instance, you might want to think twice about shuffling into a train station with a backpack. You fit the profile. Sorry, but that's the way it is..if you don't like it, you can always go back to wherever it is you came from.

[gtalum]

By the way, how do you spot a muslim? What does a muslim look like?

I'm not a muslim or arabic myself, but I have plenty of friends who are of arabic descent. I used to take a lot of "mileage runs" (trips with the sole goal of earnign frequent flyer miles) with one particular arabic friend. We used to have a good time scaring the wits out of racist cowards on flights.

I guess we (especially he) were lucky not to get arrested.

[j]

We used to have a good time scaring the wits out of cowards on flights.

Now aren't you something special. I hope you get arrested and strip searched.