2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16) 12z GFS on long range has Caribbean Cruiser

#541 Postby CyclonicFury » Thu Jun 25, 2020 1:54 pm

Shell Mound wrote:
Ubuntwo wrote:
Shell Mound wrote:One thing is clear: models do not suggest that conditions will become especially conducive in the Atlantic until mid-July or later. Even during the first half of July, despite the onset of the CCKW, the global models still show a rather persistent TUTT over/near the Greater Antilles. This would shear apart anything that manages to develop, regardless of SAL/sinking air. Already this is a sharp difference between 2020 and 1933/2005. During the latter two hyperactive seasons, the Atlantic mustered Cat-2+ hurricanes as early as the first week of July. So we can already safely rule out that this season will be like 1933/2005, even in terms of overall ACE rather than numbers. On the other hand, borderline or lower-end “hyperactive” seasons such as 1996 and 2017 are still in play, although I’d lean more toward the former than the latter at this stage, given the possibility of strong trade winds due to enhanced ridging and retrograding TUTTs during peak season.

While I agree that this season will fall far short of 2005 and 1933, I don't think the semi-continuous presence of a TUTT on modeling is something to extrapolate an entire season's activity off of.

Well, a persistent TUTT not only signifies increased vertical wind shear and (typically) sinking air, but also creates more weaknesses allowing storms to curve OTS. Historically, most (~75% of) major hurricanes to hit the U.S. first developed in the MDR, so if the MDR is juxtaposed with stronger shear, more sinking air, and more weaknesses in the ridging, the chances of a major hurricane hitting the U.S. are considerably lower than otherwise. It is time to watch for the recurrence of these features and their locations in real time, besides trends on models. So far 2020 has been seeing a fair amount of development in the subtropics, but with no sign as yet of the MDR becoming notably more conducive, at least through mid-July, while available evidence suggests that the next named storm is most likely to develop off the Carolinas and/or Mid-Atlantic during early July. The GFS is most probably seeing yet another convectively generated ITCZ “ghost” in the MDR, given the tiny size of the vortex on the latest run(s). The EC/EPS and other dynamical models are far less aggressive.

I think you base your claims too much on short-term trends and not enough on long-term trends. The CFS shear forecasts are subject to frequent fluctuations. It's not a surprise we haven't had any MDR development yet - it's June 25th! Regardless, the environment for MDR TCG may be more conducive than normal in July, with above normal SSTs, a favorable base state, and strong rising motion over Africa/The IO.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16) 12z GFS on long range has Caribbean Cruiser

#542 Postby stormlover2013 » Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:20 pm

CyclonicFury wrote:
Shell Mound wrote:
Ubuntwo wrote:While I agree that this season will fall far short of 2005 and 1933, I don't think the semi-continuous presence of a TUTT on modeling is something to extrapolate an entire season's activity off of.

Well, a persistent TUTT not only signifies increased vertical wind shear and (typically) sinking air, but also creates more weaknesses allowing storms to curve OTS. Historically, most (~75% of) major hurricanes to hit the U.S. first developed in the MDR, so if the MDR is juxtaposed with stronger shear, more sinking air, and more weaknesses in the ridging, the chances of a major hurricane hitting the U.S. are considerably lower than otherwise. It is time to watch for the recurrence of these features and their locations in real time, besides trends on models. So far 2020 has been seeing a fair amount of development in the subtropics, but with no sign as yet of the MDR becoming notably more conducive, at least through mid-July, while available evidence suggests that the next named storm is most likely to develop off the Carolinas and/or Mid-Atlantic during early July. The GFS is most probably seeing yet another convectively generated ITCZ “ghost” in the MDR, given the tiny size of the vortex on the latest run(s). The EC/EPS and other dynamical models are far less aggressive.

I think you base your claims too much on short-term trends and not enough on long-term trends. The CFS shear forecasts are subject to frequent fluctuations. It's not a surprise we haven't had any MDR development yet - it's June 25th! Regardless, the environment for MDR TCG may be more conducive than normal in July, with above normal SSTs, a favorable base state, and strong rising motion over Africa/The IO.



Exactly it’s June and we already have 4 named storms, prob will have 3-4 in July, then 5-6 in August, we could be looking at 12 name storms starting into sept with 3 months left!!
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#544 Postby Ubuntwo » Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:42 pm


He posted yesterday's 12z run :P Today's 12z has a further increase in MDR activity, as well as reduced support for the subtropical Atlantic development.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#545 Postby Ubuntwo » Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:47 pm

Image
Here's that newest EPS. More support for that AEW.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16) 12z GFS on long range has Caribbean Cruiser

#546 Postby SEASON_CANCELED » Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:55 pm

Tropics will be quiet for a few weeks till the dust settles out.

Enjoy the break
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#547 Postby AnnularCane » Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:22 pm

Jr0d wrote:Go back to 2005, plenty of people on here were saying SAL was going to be a major inhibitor...even going into August.

As posted before on here, it's only June.

It looks like the GFS has dropped the NW Carribean/GoM storm. The long ranger looms pretty quiet. I can tell you that in Key West, the water temperatures are boiling hot. A lot of fisherman are concerned what the temps will be in August given where they are now. It would be nice to have an early season disorganized storm to help cool off the water, but I dont see that happening, especially now the GFS has dropped the system it trying to develop. Certainly not a good set-up for later this year, too many ingredients for major storms. I will be surprised if we do not see another cat 5 this season, I just hope the big ones stay offshore.


Was SAL an inhibitor in 2005? I know the MDR wasn't very active that year. Or was it something else that made it less active?
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#548 Postby Ubuntwo » Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:36 pm

AnnularCane wrote:
Jr0d wrote:Go back to 2005, plenty of people on here were saying SAL was going to be a major inhibitor...even going into August.

As posted before on here, it's only June.

It looks like the GFS has dropped the NW Carribean/GoM storm. The long ranger looms pretty quiet. I can tell you that in Key West, the water temperatures are boiling hot. A lot of fisherman are concerned what the temps will be in August given where they are now. It would be nice to have an early season disorganized storm to help cool off the water, but I dont see that happening, especially now the GFS has dropped the system it trying to develop. Certainly not a good set-up for later this year, too many ingredients for major storms. I will be surprised if we do not see another cat 5 this season, I just hope the big ones stay offshore.


Was SAL an inhibitor in 2005? I know the MDR wasn't very active that year. Or was it something else that made it less active?

Perhaps it was... But those AEWs developed in the more favorable conditions of the Caribbean and Gulf, bringing the impacts closer to land.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#549 Postby NDG » Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:27 pm

The Euro ensembles are dreaming of development over in the middle of the SAL in the MDR. There's no way anything will survive as soon as they start getting away from the ITCZ and gain latitude.
SAL is stronger and more widespread than this same time last year.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#550 Postby NDG » Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:29 pm

AnnularCane wrote:
Jr0d wrote:Go back to 2005, plenty of people on here were saying SAL was going to be a major inhibitor...even going into August.

As posted before on here, it's only June.

It looks like the GFS has dropped the NW Carribean/GoM storm. The long ranger looms pretty quiet. I can tell you that in Key West, the water temperatures are boiling hot. A lot of fisherman are concerned what the temps will be in August given where they are now. It would be nice to have an early season disorganized storm to help cool off the water, but I dont see that happening, especially now the GFS has dropped the system it trying to develop. Certainly not a good set-up for later this year, too many ingredients for major storms. I will be surprised if we do not see another cat 5 this season, I just hope the big ones stay offshore.


Was SAL an inhibitor in 2005? I know the MDR wasn't very active that year. Or was it something else that made it less active?


It was an inhibitor over in the central and eastern MDR.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#551 Postby toad strangler » Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:32 pm

NDG wrote:The Euro ensembles are dreaming of development over in the middle of the SAL in the MDR. There's no way anything will survive as soon as they start getting away from the ITCZ and gain latitude.
SAL is stronger and more widespread than this same time last year.


It's stronger and widespread now. Indications suggest this won't hold. Also, as mentioned previously today on the forum, SAL is not a 100% death sentence when other factors are favorable.

 https://twitter.com/BigJoeBastardi/status/1276177296303575041


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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#552 Postby OuterBanker » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:30 pm

I don't see the Gulf storm on the 18z. But what I do see is that all the models are showing a low existing N C coast. In fact a pair of them several days apart. I don't think they will become tropical and all take them OTS. But I guess that one of them could add to the name list. Also, a couple days ago the low was exiting around the DelMarVa. Now southern NC. If the models shift further south of would mean warmer waters. We shall see.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#553 Postby TheProfessor » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:54 pm

OuterBanker wrote:I don't see the Gulf storm on the 18z. But what I do see is that all the models are showing a low existing N C coast. In fact a pair of them several days apart. I don't think they will become tropical and all take them OTS. But I guess that one of them could add to the name list. Also, a couple days ago the low was exiting around the DelMarVa. Now southern NC. If the models shift further south of would mean warmer waters. We shall see.


The energy is still there but it's even further south than the 12z run as it hits Belize instead of the southern Yucatan. It's never able to tighten back up once it gets into the Gulf during the run.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#554 Postby Ubuntwo » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:27 pm

Support for the Gulf system is dying on the GFS - on top of the aforementioned PV, ridging has continued to trend much stronger over the Gulf. This would bury any AEW into Central America before development.
Image
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#555 Postby TheProfessor » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:30 pm

Another shift south on the 0z GFS. The energy gets caught up with central America and never has a chance of developing.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#556 Postby TheProfessor » Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:07 am

Interestingly enough there's a pretty clear tropical wave on tonight's Canadian at hour 120. However it's quite a bit to the north as the wave passes through Puerto Rico and Hispaniola before the energy stalls around the Bahamas. It stays weak the whole time, but something to watch and see if trends start on future runs.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#557 Postby floridasun78 » Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:12 am

models dont have good handly what going on their show system all over place
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#558 Postby Ubuntwo » Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:49 am

Image
Strongest signals yet.
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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#559 Postby GCANE » Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:56 am

00Z Models picking up on this wave currently at 30W
Looks like it is far enough south of SAL

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Re: 2020 Global Model Runs Discussion (Out thru day 16)

#560 Postby Ubuntwo » Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:57 am


Already a thread on it!
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