Nor' Easter In May 2005

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brunota2003
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Nor' Easter In May 2005

#1 Postby brunota2003 » Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:24 am

this is interesting...from the NWS report here in NC:
Event Overview - On May 6, 2005, an unseasonable, impressive Nor' Easter buffeted the North Carolina coast with hurricane force wind gusts, torrential rain and high surf. Winds gusted up to 79 mph at Cedar Island in Carteret County, with numerous reports of 50 to 70 mph wind gusts all along the central and northeast North Carolina coast. Downeast Carteret county experienced the brunt of the coastal flooding and winds as 45-55 mph sustained northeast winds, gusting to near 80 mph at times, inundated the area with water from the Pamlico Sound. Areas such as Adams Creek, Clubfoot Creek and Slocum Creek experienced moderate flooding with water levels reaching 4-6 feet above normal. Buoy 41025 (Diamond) reported up to 20 foot wave heights during the peak of the storm. Rainfall amounts between 4 and 7 inches were common in most coastal counties, causing localized flooding in low-lying areas. This event was remarkable in that the sustained winds/gusts, rainfall totals and extent of coastal flooding were comparable to that of a strong tropical storm. Indeed, visible satellite imagery even showed an eye-like feature at the center of the surface low as it passed to the southeast of Cape Hatteras.
now...I know it wont be upgraded, and I have known about this system for quite a while now, I just thought it was interesting as I was looking thru my NWS Event Summaries and Case Studies...also, here is a sat pic taken on May 7th, 2005, just one day after causing the winds up above... Image
For the rest of the data and stories, please visit this link: http://www.erh.noaa.gov/mhx/06May2005/050605event.html
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#2 Postby george_r_1961 » Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:46 pm

I remember that quite well, and was certain it had enough tropical features to be classified as a subtropical storm.
Last edited by george_r_1961 on Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#3 Postby brunota2003 » Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:48 pm

i thought so to...contacted one of my local NWS employees on Sunday, actually the guy who wrote the article, but havent gotten a reply back yet...so...hope he says either way...
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#4 Postby Jim Cantore » Mon Mar 20, 2006 7:46 pm

It sure looks like one, thats always a start 8-)
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#5 Postby brunota2003 » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:42 am

The guy who wrote the article have been chatting on it...first the LONG explantion, then his thoughts on it...explantion:
Tim,

As far as I know, the NHC/TAFB folks have not mentioned this
particular storm system... meaning as far as they're concerned this
was an extratropical event. Of course, I could be wrong and I'll dig a
little deeper on the subject. I'm assuming you've read the case
study.. so.. that's the best reference that I know of that's out there
right now.. unless someone is actively (university grad student, govt.
or private sector) doing rsearch on it.. which is always a possibility.

My own thoughts are pretty much spelled out in the case review at:

http://www.erh.noaa.gov/mhx/06May2005/050605event.html

A few more thoughts for you.. since I know you love this type of
weather. There are several major differences between tropical and
extatropical systems. Here is the crash course, if you don't already
know...

Tropical systems form and maintain themselves in more or less
barotropic environments (environments that are fairly uniform in
temperature along a constant horizontal pressure surface) and derive
their energy from the latent heat release of organized clusters of
thunderstorms (tropical waves) in the low tropical latitudes that are
10+ degrees N or S of the equator where the coriolis effect is strong
enough to cause that essential cyclonic curvature). Latent heat
release occurs when water vapor condenses into liquid water droplets
as moist air in the thunderstorms is forced to rise and cool to its
lifted condensation level (LCL). If conditions are right.. i.e. warm
water (80+ F) and weak wind shear aloft...an inital tropical wave may
soon become an efficient heat engine that results in a feedback loop
where latent heat release warms the atmosphere and causes the surface
pressure beneath to drop (warm air is less dense, lower pressure
beneath a warmer column of air)...resulting in a stronger pressure
gradient at the surface...stronger winds/moisture inflow into the
system... more fuel (in the form of moisure/subsequent latent heat
release)...which in turn warms the atmosphere more and keeps dropping
the surface pressure...increasing the winds/moisture transport...and
so on and so forth...this is where you can see the positive feedback
cycle kick in. Once an eye forms...the heat engine becomes even more
efficient as subsidence in the eye warms the air dry adiabatically as
it sinks and compresses...further warming the column of air in the
central core of convection and further dropping the surface pressures.
That is why these systems are called 'warm-core' systems.

Extratropical systems derive their energy from baroclinic
environments...that is...environments where there are large
temperature differences over short distances along a constant pressure
surface (usually in the mid-latitudes ~30-50 degreees N or S of the
equator). These systems have warm/cold fronts and are the result of
the stetching of pre-existing vorticity that exists along strong
temperature gradients (i.e. in the winter along the NC coast where
inland temps can be in the 30s and offshore temps in the gulf stream
just 100 miles away can be in the 70s). The stretching of this pre-
existing sfc vorticity is accomplished by positive vorticity advection
assoc/w upper-level systems such as 500 mb troughs, shortwaves, lows
and also via diffluence aloft assoc/w ageostropic circulations in jet
entrance and exits. Extratropical cyclogenesis can be looked at in
many different ways and it is pretty tough to describe it any more
than I have...and it would take much longer...and the description
above is pretty technical at the least. But basically...you need a
good surface temperature gradient and a potent upper-level system to
cross that gradient for an extratropical system to develop. These
systems are called 'Cold-Core' because these systems tilt W or NW with
height connecting to the cold, upstream upper-level trough or low.

As you can see, they are both very complicated weather systems...and
there are two extreme ends of the spectrum.. purely tropical and
purely extratropical.. with a lot of room in-between for storms to
have characteristics for both given the right conditions. I'll have to
take a more detailed look at the data again, but I'd say this was a
storm that definitely fell in-between the tropical and extratropical
spectrum. If the experts over at NHC haven't mentioned anything about
it...then most likely it didn't meet their criteria for subtropical
storms...or in other words it wasn't close enough to the tropical end
of the spectrum to start it as such.

His thoughts on it:
Tim,

Again, as I stated in my last e-mail (although lengthy and I gave you
no real definitive answer.. just a lot of detail on extratropical and
tropical system dynamics/differences). I do believe that this storm -
while it was located in the Atlantic on the northern edge of the Gulf
Stream - did fall between the tropial and extratropical extremes and
exhibit 'hybrid' type characteristics.

This was most notable in the IR satellite imagery from 2245Z on May 7,
2005. By 'hybrid' I mean
that the storm was likely deriving the energy it needed to briefly
appear tropical in nature (i.e. the eye-like feature and banding on
the satellite imagery) from both latent heat release and the
stretching of pre-existing surface vorticity along a baroclinic zone
at the northern edge of the Gulf Stream.
passing this along for those who actually remember this event/are interested in it/havent even heard about it...i fall under the first two...:lol: ;)
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#6 Postby wxmann_91 » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:45 am

It looks like it still has the front attached to it, I don't think it exhibited even subtropical characteristics, but I'd need more sat images to be more certain.
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#7 Postby brunota2003 » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:48 am

wxmann_91 wrote:It looks like it still has the front attached to it, I don't think it exhibited even subtropical characteristics, but I'd need more sat images to be more certain.
you remember the Unamed Hurricane of 1991? aka the Halloween Storm...
EDIT: Here is a pic of the 1991 system...:
Image
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#8 Postby brunota2003 » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:52 am

those two look strikingly similar if you ask me...
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#9 Postby wxmann_91 » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:53 am

brunota2003 wrote:
wxmann_91 wrote:It looks like it still has the front attached to it, I don't think it exhibited even subtropical characteristics, but I'd need more sat images to be more certain.
you remember the Unamed Hurricane of 1991? aka the Halloween Storm...


Yes, but that was different. The llc was nearly complete detached from the front. This one is a bit closer. Although I would see like to see some visibles from the event.
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#10 Postby weatherwoman132 » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:51 am

does anyone have a satellite picture of the blizzard of 06?
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