The burning season cometh

[Extremeweatherguy]

Our weather here in SoCal is relatively stable compared to most of the country, but not as "boring" as you would think.

2005 was a record year for us as far as rainfall in SoCal & up until the very end of the year Los Angeles had recorded more rainfall than Seattle!!

It wasn't your typical 1/2 inch storms as well. We were under categorical watch for thunderstorms by the SPC almost every week in January and February and had one SLGT & MOD risk of severe weather as well.

Our weather pattern last year would have rivaled any spot in the country as we had numerous tornadoes, several rounds of hail (I recorded 1 3/8 inch hail at my house) and winds up to 80 miles per hour.

Snow is only 1 hour away from my house and we got inundated with that as well. Basically, if wxmann lived in SoCal in 2005 he would have been a pretty happy camper.

The numerous tornadoes you are refering to were all quite weak (compaed to the plains). An F-0 or F-1 tornado is similar to going through a brief period of TS force (F0) or Hurricane Force (F1/F2) winds. The tornados in the plains however can be F-3, F-4 or F-5 intensity which is similar to a Cat.4/5 hurricane or stronger. Once you get into the F4 and F5 range..the damage is incredible. Sure an F0 is still bad for some as some small trees and large branches are downed and may be a few fences, but in the most part they are not killers and not the big destructors.

[aveosmth]

You are absolutely right...I would never compare our tornadoes to the twisters in the Plains States (although my cousin's apartment complex did lose their roof thanks to an unconfirmed twister)

Nevertheless, the 1 3/8 inch hail that we got a couple of times last year was really big news & the confirmed 18 inch hail storm that hit South Central Los Angeles in 2003 was one of the biggest hail events to hit the entire country in recent times.

[WaitingForSiren]

Extremeweatherguy, you took the words right out of my mouth. Also, the intensity of the rain in CA is NOTHING compared to that of a real thunderstorm. In SoCal the heaviest is what, 1.5 inches per hour? Where i live we get 4-6 inches per hour with the heaviest storms.

Not to brag or anything about our weather, I actually just feel sorry for anyone who hasnt experienced it. It is so great to see, i cant imagine ever going through my life without ever seeing a big time thunderstorm. but oh well, wxman, maybe you can become am meteorologist some day for a cool state, or else go storm chasing.

[wxmann_91]

Not to brag or anything about our weather, I actually just feel sorry for anyone who hasnt experienced it. It is so great to see, i cant imagine ever going through my life without ever seeing a big time thunderstorm. but oh well, wxman, maybe you can become am meteorologist some day for a cool state, or else go storm chasing.

Well, I did live in Dallas for five years before I moved to Las Vegas (and then to San Diego), so it's not like I've never seen a thunderstorm.

I remember one evening I was talking to my friend and I saw some TCU off in the distance, as the sun was setting. Later, when it was almost dark, I turned on the TV and saw a SVR warning for Dallas County, and I went out and the mammatus I saw were awesome.

Another instance there must've been a line of supercells across N-Ctrl TX and I was watching TV and every minute there we beeps cause new Tornado Warnings were being issued. It was so scary cause well it seems Dallas is lucky cause I do not recall ever being under a tornado warning during the five years I was living there. Tornadoes reached Ft. Worth before, all of a sudden, they began to weaken as they moved into Dallas County. A huge windstorm, but that scared me half to death.

Sorry for blabbering on and on. But those two events really sparked me to be interested in meteorology.

[WaitingForSiren]

Nah its perfectly alright,those were good stories. I also have some events that sparked my interest in meteorology.

The earliest storm I can remember is when I was real young and my cousin was babysitting me and my sister, and there was a big severe weather outbreak going on with tornado warnings all over the TV. I remember i could hardly sleep i was so scared, but I did. Then, one day I woke up and there were hail-oles all over our plants, that was pretty cool.

But the one storm that REALLY got me fired up on the weather was July 1st 1997. I remember early in the day we had a tornado watch at around 10 AM or so, which i thought was odd for so early in the day and flood warnings out west. It was a VERY humid day, partly cloudy with plenty of Cumulus around, ripe for a severe weather outbreak. i went to the store and there was this girl working there who was freaking out because we were under a tornado warning. I didnt think much of it, I mean i was excited but thats it. When i went outside it was really windy all of a sudden, you could tell something nasty was coming. My dad was in the car picking us up and he goes "hurry up get in the car a huge storm is coming". We were driving back to the house and i saw the biggest, most amazing shelf cloud i have seen in my entire life. The storm hit with brutal force with hail and 80mph winds...and there were trees uprooted in the neighborhood. It was pitch black during it as well, and the rain was 5 inches per hour.

After that storm i was afraid of storms for a while, but i got over it and realized how much I was into the weather. I mean, even before that i was into it a bit, but that storm reinforced it. I remember back in like 5th grade watching the weather channel for the severe weather outlooks, i think I even remember the 1-21-99 "high risk" outlook day. I remember watching tv and seeing a high risk for lousiana then later seeing video on the news for tornadoes.

[WaitingForSiren]

Oh and the july 1 1997 was on a high risk day.

[Aslkahuna]

Actually, there have been fatalties with F0 tornadoes. A rainfall rate of 4-6 inches per hour is not very impressive-not when one has seen rates of up to 12 inches per hour like I have during our monsoon storms. The storm of July 25, 2003 dropped up to 4 inches in 20 minutes in parts of Sierra Vista and I recorded rates up to 12 in/hr on a rainrate sensor on FHU. Incidentally, highest rainfall rates ever recorded in CA exceed 1.5 in/hr by a very great amount as Opid's Camp once got 0.69in in one minute which equates to a rate of 41 inches per hour.

Steve

[Extremeweatherguy]

Actually, there have been fatalties with F0 tornadoes. A rainfall rate of 4-6 inches per hour is not very impressive-not when one has seen rates of up to 12 inches per hour like I have during our monsoon storms. The storm of July 25, 2003 dropped up to 4 inches in 20 minutes in parts of Sierra Vista and I recorded rates up to 12 in/hr on a rainrate sensor on FHU. Incidentally, highest rainfall rates ever recorded in CA exceed 1.5 in/hr by a very great amount as Opid's Camp once got 0.69in in one minute which equates to a rate of 41 inches per hour.

Steve

Yeah but the chance of dying in an F0 is 300% less likely when compared to a strong tornado. The only real way to die would be if you were stupid enough to stand outside near trees, be in a car near trees, or if you were trying to hide in a shed. In an F5 however, you will face likely death anywhere above ground, in a direct hit, the safest place to be would be a storm shelter and many do not live if they are hit directly and are not below ground in an F5. Also, about the rainfall rate thing. 0.69in in one minute may have been quite significant for that one minute...but did it last an hour? no... So really I think we need to talk about the times when 4"+ actually did fall in an hour or less...because that is when it is quite significant. And as for the 12" an hour in Arizona...once again you do not see 12" fall total in the hour...the rates may have reached that, but the one hour total was probably much less. When I lived in Phoenix we rarely saw a total rainfall of over 1" and most storms were dry thunderstorms...nothing like those of the plains.

[Aslkahuna]

Phoenix and Sierra Vista are two very different locales when it comes to rainfall during the monsoon-like I said the storm of JUly 25, 2003 dropped up to 4 inches of rain in 20 minutes in parts of SV. One inch rainfalls during the Summer are very common around here as well in the foothills around Tucson. The 0.69in/min at Opids Camp may not have lasted an hour but I'm sure that the storm didn't just suddenly stop at that point but went on for some time. When the visibility drops to zero in heavy rain and blasting wind it's hard to convince me that the storm isn't as bad as what occurs somewhere else-especially since I've been in storms from MO to the East Coast and in the Tropics.

Steve

[WaitingForSiren]

.69 in one minute? Im a bit skepticle of that. I meant generally speaking you wont see 4-6 inches of rain in one hour in CA. Maybe 2 inches or so.

[Aslkahuna]

Until the 1.26 in in one minute measured in Maryland in 1956, the Opid's Camp report was the official US record for one minute rain for many years. As for CA not getting 4 inch rains in an hour or less, you need to look away from the cities and take a close look at the automated station reports from the coastal ranges from SoCA all of the way up because if you do you will find a number of such reports. Then there are the toad stranglers in the Summer when the monsoon flow hits the desert side of the mountains. Nobody probably knows for sure what happens in those mountains when the intense thunderstorms hit but when you get a 20 foot wall of water running through some poor desert town you know something bad has happened. Anyone who's ever been through a SE AZ Chubasco knows that those storms take a back seat to nobody's storms anywhere.

Steve

[WaitingForSiren]

I have a HARD TIME believing that Maryland even ever HAD record. Sure, the record books may so so, but i doubt it. Think of the storms in the Plains or in Texas that are very slow moving but have intense radar returns. I think the problem is that automated reports tend to only come from populated areas. Therefor, if a place gets 12 inches of rain in 5 seconds in Kansas, it would be hard to tell. I think the reports are at fault.

[Aslkahuna]

The Maryland record was set on July 4, 1956 and I read the report in Monthly Weather Review some time later about how that record was verified which required some exhaustive testing of the recording guage and actually took well over a year to complete the process which is why that record is accepted today. I did a similar analysis of a recording guage record of a thunderstorm that dumped very close to 3 inches of rain on FHU in less than an hour. I did that study as a forensics report for the Tech Director of a Test Center I supported because he was worried about the drainage of rainwater from the roof of a new building being built across the street from us. I derived a peak rainfall rate of 7.2 inches per hour from that record and from that told the Tech Director that under extreme circumstances rates of 10 in/hr or more could occur. Based upon that he suggested a change in the roof design but was overruled. Later events proved both my assessment and his concerns were correct and flooding of the building remained a problem for years. Ironically, the building was named in his honor after he retired and then died.

Steve